Reply to: Ed Balls again

[DodgyAgent]

The borrowing figures for 1986-1996 include a period of recession and the resulting increase in borrowing due to higher government spending and lower tax revenue. The trend was clear, so Brown was left a golden legacy of declining inflation, declining deficits and a growing economy.

The borrowing for 1997-2007 covered a period of growth, helped by public and private borrowing, low inflation (helped by Chinese imports to suppress prices).

What your figures fail to show is that in the TWO years following 2007, the government deficit was a massive £225.3 billion.

Labour left the coalition a huge financial mess, which was never going to take a few years to sort out.

Which is what is meant by context . Well pointed out.

[centurian]

Labour ran a deficit through the best economic times since the war justifying this as OK as there never would be another downturn, never, ever, as Brown had golden rules and he had 'fixed' the UK economy forever. Idiots like you believed him.

WHS

"An End to Boom and Bust" wasn't just a political sound-bite. Gordon Brown actually believed his own PR bull - he really thought he had abolished recessions, so that the normal rules of "don't run a deficit during a boom" simply didn't apply to him.

[Waldorf]

The first thing that Brown did as chancellor was to pay off the debt from the Major government.

No he did not. The government debt (ie our debt) have never been paid off.

The deficit was turned into a surplus for 4 years, due to Brown keeping to Ken Clarke's spending plans. After the 2001 election, they then let rip with the cheque book and the deficits started to pile up.

Deficit = the annual shortfall of tax revenues over government spending
Debt = the accumulation of the annual deficits

[Waldorf]

Government borrowing 1986-1996 = £233.6bn
Government borrowing 1997-2007 = £180.8bn

Figures have not been adjusted for inflation.

Interest bill as a percentage of government expenditure when Brown became chancellor - 9%
Interest bill as a percentage of government expenditure when Osborne became chancellor - 7%

The borrowing figures for 1986-1996 include a period of recession and the resulting increase in borrowing due to higher government spending and lower tax revenue. The trend was clear, so Brown was left a golden legacy of declining inflation, declining deficits and a growing economy.

The borrowing for 1997-2007 covered a period of growth, helped by public and private borrowing, low inflation (helped by Chinese imports to suppress prices).

What your figures fail to show is that in the TWO years following 2007, the government deficit was a massive £225.3 billion.

Labour left the coalition a huge financial mess, which was never going to take a few years to sort out.

[Doggy Styles]

Try taking out the £124bn that was given to the banks, and then compare the figures.

If you can't understand that giving away £124bn might have an impact on the amount of money you need to borrow, then you are lost on the subject.

You need to understand the difference between debt and deficit.

That money given to the banks is not part of the deficit, other than interest payments to pay it back. It has gone.

The deficit is the annual new borrowings.

[Doggy Styles]

1996 - Deficit 29.2bn
1997 - Deficit 15.6bn
1998 - Surplus 0.7bn

Yep, it was the Tories that took Britain back into the black in 1998.

As you can see the Tory spending plans were already reducing the deficit when Labour came to power in 1997. A golden legacy it was called at the time.

Brown carried on following the outgoing Tories' spending plans until 1999/2000. That's why the deficit carried on reducing.

[minestrone]

If you compare Labour's spending in recession with Major's spending in recession, and take out the money that we gave to the banks, the spending patterns are similar.

If Major had faced a similar banking collapse and had to spend £124bn, then his budget deficit would have been even worse than it already was.


Aw bless, it can't make a comprehensible argument without needing to resort to ad hominem attacks.

And if you cannot work out my former posting ID, which I'd assumed that pretty much everyone here had managed to do, maybe someone will lend you the notes and explain it to you.

Believe me, the levels of unbearable stupidity between present and your former self can quite clearly be extrapolated.

[DirtyDog]

Labour ran a deficit through the best economic times since the war justifying this as OK as there never would be another downturn, never, ever, as Brown had golden rules and he had 'fixed' the UK economy forever. Idiots like you believed him.

If you compare Labour's spending in recession with Major's spending in recession, and take out the money that we gave to the banks, the spending patterns are similar.

If Major had faced a similar banking collapse and had to spend £124bn, then his budget deficit would have been even worse than it already was.

If you seriously think that you can compare an economy in downturn and an economy in growth as the same as they have the same deficit then you are a complete cretin. Which banned poster did your simple mind crawl out from?

Aw bless, it can't make a comprehensible argument without needing to resort to ad hominem attacks.

And if you cannot work out my former posting ID, which I'd assumed that pretty much everyone here had managed to do, maybe someone will lend you the notes and explain it to you.

[minestrone]

Try taking out the £124bn that was given to the banks, and then compare the figures.

If you can't understand that giving away £124bn might have an impact on the amount of money you need to borrow, then you are lost on the subject.

Labour ran a deficit through the best economic times since the war justifying this as OK as there never would be another downturn, never, ever, as Brown had golden rules and he had 'fixed' the UK economy forever. Idiots like you believed him.

If you seriously think that you can compare an economy in downturn and an economy in growth as the same as they have the same deficit then you are a complete cretin. Which banned poster did your simple mind crawl out from?

[Bunk]

Try taking out the £124bn that was given to the banks, and then compare the figures.

If you can't understand that giving away £124bn might have an impact on the amount of money you need to borrow, then you are lost on the subject.

That's the point, it should have had less impact because we should have had money saved up during the good years. But we didn't, Brown had spunked it all up the walls.

[DirtyDog]

Again, since you clearly did not read or understand it the first time, the borrowing under Major was done in time of recession, the pre crisis borrowing under brown was done in times of economic growth.

You should be comparing the major deficit and the labour post banking crisis deficit.

IF you can't see that and understand that then you are lost on this subject.

Try taking out the £124bn that was given to the banks, and then compare the figures.

If you can't understand that giving away £124bn might have an impact on the amount of money you need to borrow, then you are lost on the subject.

[minestrone]

ILabour spending up until the banking crisis was no more out of control than the spending under the Major government.

Again, since you clearly did not read or understand it the first time, the borrowing under Major was done in time of recession, the pre crisis borrowing under brown was done in times of economic growth.

You should be comparing the major deficit and the labour post banking crisis deficit.

IF you can't see that and understand that then you are lost on this subject.

[DirtyDog]

Wot, like the Millennium Dome?

That wasn't at low interest rates.

I was thinking more along the lines of HS2 under a decent funding scheme rather than the bastard child of PFI which is on offer.

[KentPhilip]

I would like to thank Ed Balls for handing lots of Labour votes to UKIP.
Labour will overtake the tories soon, in the rate of defections to us

[Mich the Tester]

Unless you can borrow at record low rates to fund infrastructure projects, of course.

Wot, like the Millennium Dome?