Reply to: Tax Hell: 73% rates cripple UK families, killing 'aspiration nation'

[socialworker]

[QUOTE=Jeff Maginty;1670297]They should cap benefits at the equivalent of the average wage (after tax of course).


They are just about to. It is called Universal Credit and it comes in this year.

I don't approve of people having kids they can't afford either but I disapprove even more of kids going hungry or wearing shoes two sizes too small.


Not going to take the bait on the 'taking kids into care' suggestion as that is surely just a wind up.

[Jeff Maginty]

..

[lilelvis2000]

Unfortunately too many soft liberals hold your view. I on the other hand am a firm believer that given the right motivation (ie no money to fall back on) it is amazing how driven people are.
There are millions of able bodied people who have been taken out of the work market by the soft belly of welfare encouraged by the destructive "kindness" of the liberal left, who are more concerned with feeling good about themselves than helping others.

There is a balance to be struck really. Short term soft-landing is better than none ('cause it seems everyone spends 110% of their incomes on this island). And capped benefits lasting no more than , say, 18 months. 'During that period training and education would be mandatory.


Now...if only we could barbeque the bankers, the regulators and the politicians that created this mess in the first place.

[DodgyAgent]

If young people were given no dole than their parents would support them. Those that don't have parents or other family members end up on the street as now.

Not every person in the world is intelligent enough to do the jobs that we have a skills shortage in, and those who can only do menial or call centre jobs are competing against older people including OAPs who have a much better work ethic and customer service skills.


Yeah right.

You know how prison staff rule don't you? It's by the consent of the prisoners as they don't have guns.

If prisoners want to go on the rampage they can and will.

Unfortunately too many soft liberals hold your view. I on the other hand am a firm believer that given the right motivation (ie no money to fall back on) it is amazing how driven people are.
There are millions of able bodied people who have been taken out of the work market by the soft belly of welfare encouraged by the destructive "kindness" of the liberal left, who are more concerned with feeling good about themselves than helping others.

[OwlHoot]

If young people were given no dole than their parents would support them. Those that don't have parents or other family members end up on the street as now.

Not every person in the world is intelligent enough to do the jobs that we have a skills shortage in, and those who can only do menial or call centre jobs are competing against older people including OAPs who have a much better work ethic and customer service skills.

Yeah right.

You know how prison staff rule don't you? It's by the consent of the prisoners as they don't have guns.

If prisoners want to go on the rampage they can and will.

Hmm, guess I am being a bit idealistic. That's not like me.

So essentially the UK has been shafted by do gooders for the last 50 years or more, arguably at least 100 years, and now it's too late to do anything significant about it!

[lilelvis2000]

Hogwash, sorry.

If young people were given no dole and employers incentivised to train them on the job the problem would be solved almost overnight.

Didn't Labour try that..and recently the Conservatives too. Its hard to motivate people who are interested in doing one area of work, but the programmes are all in another area. I look at myself - I tried something else for a few months and got bored of it and went back to looking for work in IT. After more than one year of the occasional job, I've finally landed two six month contracts. And I was happy to do that.

I'm okay with a dole system (not that I use it because I don't) - its better that then end up like the US.

[SueEllen]

Hogwash, sorry.

If young people were given no dole and employers incentivised to train them on the job the problem would be solved almost overnight.

If young people were given no dole than their parents would support them. Those that don't have parents or other family members end up on the street as now.

Not every person in the world is intelligent enough to do the jobs that we have a skills shortage in, and those who can only do menial or call centre jobs are competing against older people including OAPs who have a much better work ethic and customer service skills.

Also, if there was still a shortage of labour for seasonal crop picking then convicts could be given the job, and any who misbehaved or absconded could be thrown into solitary in some damp dungeon for six months.

Yeah right.

You know how prison staff rule don't you? It's by the consent of the prisoners as they don't have guns.

If prisoners want to go on the rampage they can and will.

[OwlHoot]

Nope - due to how economy works we cannot force young people into training in the areas we need skills in, and also due to the fact that people aren't going to follow the crops around the country for 9 months of the year to pick them, we need immigrants.

Hogwash, sorry.

If young people were given no dole and employers incentivised to train them on the job the problem would be solved almost overnight.

Also, if there was still a shortage of labour for seasonal crop picking then convicts could be given the job, and any who misbehaved or absconded could be thrown into solitary in some damp dungeon for six months.

[SueEllen]

Shouldn't the government step in during emergencies? Not sure I am just asking!

Yep but not if it was suppose to be covered by an insurance policy.

Councils like other public bodies will be allowed to self-insure. So in some cases they will decide it's cheaper not to have insurance policies i.e. public liability in place.

I can't think a big cost for councils but this is one example for police authorities

[BrilloPad]

That's for emergencies like now when the government has cut their budgets.

Even then they still have to keep some of it back for major disasters i.e. flooding.

Shouldn't the government step in during emergencies? Not sure I am just asking!

[SueEllen]

And don't they have quite alot of money stashed away?

EDIT : linky Eric Pickles attacks councils for 'stashing away billions' - Telegraph

That's for emergencies like now when the government has cut their budgets.

Even then they still have to keep some of it back for major disasters i.e. flooding.

[BrilloPad]

I have little sympathy for councils bleating on...they got fat in the good years.

And don't they have quite alot of money stashed away?

EDIT : linky http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/poli...-billions.html

[lilelvis2000]

how much is the council tax compared to average income?

we in the UK are at £1200/£25k.

Unless you live up north of course...where its £1200/£14k
and it only got to £1200 by many years of 5% increases - even though the inflation rate was < 2%.

I have little sympathy for councils bleating on...they got fat in the good years.

[SueEllen]

Surely that applies only if the economy is running at full steam and every indigenous employable person is already working, and labour demand still outstrips supply.

Nope - due to how economy works we cannot force young people into training in the areas we need skills in, and also due to the fact that people aren't going to follow the crops around the country for 9 months of the year to pick them, we need immigrants.

Yes in an idea country we would have employers wouldn't be scared of hiring women with small children, people with disabilities or whatever prejudice they have but we aren't in an ideal country. You can blame it on red tape but to be honest some of the crookedest things I've heard have nothing to do with red tape but people's - employers and employees -stupidity, laziness and meanness.

[doodab]

Suppose this is an age-old question, where does the f**k the money all go? Lightings, bins, community centres, staff, roads...and what else?

UK government expenditure 2014 - Pie Charts Tables