Reply to: What's the point in life sentences..

russian prisons

Russian prisons are hell on earth -- it is typical for them to be overpopulated, and by that I don't mean Western meaning of overpopulated, but by having 3 shifts of people to sleep on the same bed. That's right - 45 people stuffed in a cell with 15 beds, sleeping is done in turns.

What's worse this sort of condition is often used on people who wait for their trial (they have not yet been convicted of anything), this wait can last for years.

Russian penetantiary system is seriously fked up and it has nothing to do with justice whatsoever: scumbags criminals with connections have good life in prison: have mobile phones, drugs, women smuggled in etc.

Re: concurrency

at £20K a year for a prisoner, compare that to the massive sums wasted on trying repeat offenders I'm sure the sums would add up.

Especially if we outsourced our lifers to ex russian states which spend about 30p a day on prisoners in their better prisons.

concurrency

Two, or ten, concurrent sentences is no different to one.

I don't have an issue with concurrency -- to fight the problem of someone robbing 10 grandmas and getting 10 concurrent sentences, in effect being one, the court should just give 20-life years to anybody who is judged to be persistent offender.

especially for fudge packers

Being near the Devon border, I know a couple of those.

However, I get the feeling you weren't referring to the local confectionery trade.....

> Offend again and you could be returned to gaol to continue the original sentence quite apart from any new sentence for the later offence.

So-called "concurrent" sentences for multiple convictions are the biggest rip-off in the UK justice system. Some crafty civil servant who originally suggested the idea probably figured, rightly, that your average chav would assume they meant "one after the other", i.e. consecutively, as in the US. But as far as I can see they actually mean, well, absolutely nothing! Two, or ten, concurrent sentences is no different to one.

> prison is often a home away from home

especially for fudge packers

We could easily go for 99 yr sentances without parole if we offshored the prisons to the cheapest places on earth.

For example, think of the money these countries could make by hosting all of Europe and America most dangeroues criminals:

1 East Timor
2 Somalia
3 Sierra Leone
4 Malawi
5 Tanzania
6 Burundi
7 Congo, Republic of the
8 Congo, Democratic Republic of the
9 Comoros
10 Eritrea
11 Ethiopia
12 Afghanistan
13 Niger
14 Yemen
15 Madagascar
16 Guinea-Bissau
17 Zambia
18 Kiribati
19 Nigeria
20 Mali

As to the question about what is the point of prison, to me (looking at current system) it is to protect and punish,

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Where is the punishment in the current prison system other than deprivation of liberty? Prisoners' 'rights' are now considered well before the rights of the victims and therefore prison is often a home away from home for many criminals and no deterrent at all

The biggest problem with dishing out big sentences (which Joe Public likes) is that it cost a friggin fortune to keep somebody in gaol

Sure it does but really when you match it to the cost in health,lives,safety and security that such a light criminal system brings it is definatly a lot less.

Personally i would not have so much of problem with the current system if it was apropriately leveled, but this current system where white collored criminal can end up doing more jail time than someone who commits rape or murder is crazy to Monty Python levels

As to the question about what is the point of prison, to me (looking at current system) it is to protect and punish, if it was about reform, jails would be totally and utterly different.

Depends what they do - not all crimes carry a custodial sentence. In theory you could go back inside for littering.

In fact they can go back inside for anything that breaches the terms of their license, e.g. getting into rent arrears, breaking a curfew etc. - it doesn't have to be a criminal offence.

Paco, in "been reading uk.legal recently" mode

He did mention that he'd got a contract the other week. Either that or the slugs are engaging in nookie and he's making a porno movie for his latest educational blockbuster.

I thought Xog was a bit quiet today. Anyone checked the local nick?

police have on many occasions in the past stitched up the local wierdo/thicko for crimes they couldn't solve

Now I'm worried....

The biggest problem with dishing out big sentences (which Joe Public likes) is that it cost a friggin fortune to keep somebody in gaol (and that's without even considering lost taxes from earnings and likely benefits for their family).

If you want to go the American route (long sentences and lots of them - especially for non-whites) you've got to be prepared to pay for it.

The only other option is to go for cutting bits off which sort of makes later appeals a bit pointless and our wonderful police have on many occasions in the past stitched up the local wierdo/thicko for crimes they couldn't solve.

"what the purpose of prison is; is it to punish or is it to reform?"

What about a 3rd option? ......to protect - by removing the muderer from society so they cannot re-offend , which is why all of this parole/early release is total b0ll0cks