Reply to: 24 error messages

[chef]

How big is an FDR? Suitcase sized? The ROVs needed to go that deep come attached to a pretty big ship, but as with all things if you pay enough money it will be done.

yes

[Moscow Mule]

Recoveries of FDR / CVR. I'm afraid that the bodies, unless they float to the surface, will need to remain there.

How big is an FDR? Suitcase sized? The ROVs needed to go that deep come attached to a pretty big ship, but as with all things if you pay enough money it will be done.

[Menelaus]

I would have to google it again, but I dont think anyone died.
A test team from the airline were doing acceptance testing.
This involves a full run up of the engines, which on the ground requires all brakes to be applied.
Because the brakes are on and the engines are at full tilt an auto warning sounds as this would be disastrous in normal circumstances.
To disable the warning sounds the test team disabled the warning system (somehow, cant remember details), but the upshot was that the plane went into flight mode and released all the brakes.

I am not certain of all details and have some questions but that is how it has been reported.
One question is that all these aircraft have a "weight on wheels" sensor so the system should know it is on the ground.

Not sure the test team were pilots, but humans had a hand in this.

The ultimate testers.

[The Lone Gunman]

Pilot error with the pilots still alive? Perish the thought.

EDIT: Oh, wait. This isn't the RAF.

I would have to google it again, but I dont think anyone died.
A test team from the airline were doing acceptance testing.
This involves a full run up of the engines, which on the ground requires all brakes to be applied.
Because the brakes are on and the engines are at full tilt an auto warning sounds as this would be disastrous in normal circumstances.
To disable the warning sounds the test team disabled the warning system (somehow, cant remember details), but the upshot was that the plane went into flight mode and released all the brakes.

I am not certain of all details and have some questions but that is how it has been reported.
One question is that all these aircraft have a "weight on wheels" sensor so the system should know it is on the ground.

Not sure the test team were pilots, but humans had a hand in this.

[Menelaus]

And that is a different story!

Amen.

[sesame street]
"hello kids, can you say Chinook Mull of Kintyre?"
[/sesame street]

[Menelaus]

Most likely too deep to recover big lumps of plane, but well within ROV depth limits for video inspection.

There's a few manned submersibles that can get that deep, but I'm not sure I see the benefit.

Recoveries of FDR / CVR. I'm afraid that the bodies, unless they float to the surface, will need to remain there.

[Churchill]

Pilot error with the pilots still alive? Perish the thought.

EDIT: Oh, wait. This isn't the RAF.

And that is a different story!

[Menelaus]

Not a failure from what I have read. Incompetence on behalf of the testing pilots.
When they pulled the fuse thing the planes systems automatically released the brakes as it thought it was in the air. This system is designed to stop the plane landing with its emergency brakes already applied and the obvious possibilities of that one.

This was a couple of years back now and has been doing the rounds. There are much fuller descriptions on the net than the one posted.

Pilot error with the pilots still alive? Perish the thought.

EDIT: Oh, wait. This isn't the RAF.

[The Lone Gunman]

OMFG. Ouch!

Brake failure would seem to be the obvious answer to this one.

Not a failure from what I have read. Incompetence on behalf of the testing pilots.
When they pulled the fuse thing the planes systems automatically released the brakes as it thought it was in the air. This system is designed to stop the plane landing with its emergency brakes already applied and the obvious possibilities of that one.

This was a couple of years back now and has been doing the rounds. There are much fuller descriptions on the net than the one posted.

[Menelaus]

Trueish. Here's one that amused me: some company were ground testing the engines, and because some other system kept making warning noises they pulled a fuse to shut it up, which had the knock on effect of making the aircraft brakes release, it would have jumped its chocks even if they'd placed some, and off it went. Why the crew never got round to throttling back the engines before they crashed into the wall at the end of the runway, and totalled the aircraft, just goes to show you how complex these beasties are.

linky

And this scenario has happened at least twice to my knowledge (another happened in Canada)

OMFG. Ouch!

Brake failure would seem to be the obvious answer to this one.

[Moscow Mule]

Even if they find the wreckage its going to be about 2 miles down so very hard to recover?

Most likely too deep to recover big lumps of plane, but well within ROV depth limits for video inspection.

There's a few manned submersibles that can get that deep, but I'm not sure I see the benefit.

[BrilloPad]

They have found two bodies so closer to finding the wreckage.
We need answers

Even if they find the wreckage its going to be about 2 miles down so very hard to recover?

[threaded]

I read somewhere that the controls change state as the airspeed varies... which might be a tad interesting.

And the pilot has no control over the state the control system is in...

Trueish. Here's one that amused me: some company were ground testing the engines, and because some other system kept making warning noises they pulled a fuse to shut it up, which had the knock on effect of making the aircraft brakes release, it would have jumped its chocks even if they'd placed some, and off it went. Why the crew never got round to throttling back the engines before they crashed into the wall at the end of the runway, and totalled the aircraft, just goes to show you how complex these beasties are.

linky

And this scenario has happened at least twice to my knowledge (another happened in Canada)

[niche]

They have found two bodies so closer to finding the wreckage.
We need answers

[BrilloPad]

It's pretty common in small aircraft for insects to get in there. Some even fit covers to prevent this, which brings it own problems... What tends to have happened is that the pilot hasn't taken the cover off, or checked the opening properly. Then what happens, if they're lucky, is they get a stall warning as they start to roll down the runway, if they're a little unluckier they abort take-off at a higher speed than they think they're going (because they're getting incorrect speed indications) and hit some barrier at the end of the runway.

Indeed. It happened in a crash. I saw it on air crash investigation.

I must ban Mrs BP from watching that programme.....