Reply to: New Danger - New Nazis

[Board Game Geek]

BB Posted : typical way that the Mail span the story, i.e. Johnny Foreigner robbing british jobs, rather than either of the following a) Pikey IT companies outsourcing for pratical "slave-labour" rates (I've worked with Asian IT guys and think the pittance they are paid is outrageous) or b) state-of-the-nation crisis so bad that even less "Offshoring" than previous year.

Indeed, it's getting a bit tiresome with the Mail, and I would have preferred they wrote a story like a) above.

Let's face it, it's not the fault of the foreigners coming here. It's the catalyst which makes it inviting for them to do so (slave-labour being one such catalyst). They're being exploited as much as the natives are.

BB posted : No, I wouldn't, and I don't (I don't even trust you , BGG!)

Quite right too

You're welcome. Oh and by the way, thanks to you for not reverting to asenine sarcasm or outright name calling! (like so many others do).

Not my style or MO. I can think of only one incident in the last few years when I came close, but that was after severe provocation.

You soon get to know who the wind-up merchants on the forums are (I've never understood why people do it myself. Is there a chemical reaction in the brain that soothes them or something ?).

I guess some people are just naturally argumentative and need professional help. Thankfully, this forum keeps the worst offenders off the streets, where they might be mugging old ladies with bits of C#.

We're a self-help forum here, really.

We should get NHS funding for the good work we do.

[BlightyBoy]

It wasn't added as an afterthought, more of a summary at the end of what I was trying to convey previously.

I was actually referring to the final comment in the Mail article, but hey-ho!

I do agree with you by the way, that papers should have an ethical stance when reporting the news, however, papers are written by human beings, who are fallible and make mistakes, sometimes deliberately.

Quite true. Editorial responsibility, and as for agenda, that was my gripe from the start. True, without a certain amount of "sexing-up" the story fails to be either interesting or engaging, however, my initial reaction to the article was the typical way that the Mail span the story, i.e. Johnny Foreigner robbing british jobs, rather than either of the following a) Pikey IT companies outsourcing for pratical "slave-labour" rates (I've worked with Asian IT guys and think the pittance they are paid is outrageous) or b) state-of-the-nation crisis so bad that even less "Offshoring" than previous year.

2nd Afterthought : It all comes down to trust, doesn't it ? Would you trust a stranger to report to you the facts of a situation ? How would you easily verify their report ?

No, I wouldn't, and I don't (I don't even trust you , BGG!)

3rd Afterthought : Thanks for a stimulating discussion by the way. This is the stuff the old forums were legendary for !

You're welcome. Oh and by the way, thanks to you for not reverting to asenine sarcasm or outright name calling! (like so many others do).

[Board Game Geek]

BB posted : Why would you want to "sex-up" the content of your fridge (in your example) unless you wanted to appear more interesting than a simple dullard with coffee and sauce?

Because of a number of motives of course.

1. To interest and inform the reader.
2. To provide infomation that they may find useful.
3. You could argue that it could be an attempt to appear more interesting, however, in this case, that was not the intent.

BB posted : People who are less intelligent that we two may fail to see the portent of the last line (added, it appears, somewhat as an afterthought) and act solely on the remaining 99% of the story which is about Johnny Foreigner comin' to good ole Blighty and arf-'incin' all the jobs. Which is not a faithful reproduction of the truth.

It wasn't added as an afterthought, more of a summary at the end of what I was trying to convey previously.

I do agree with you by the way, that papers should have an ethical stance when reporting the news, however, papers are written by human beings, who are fallible and make mistakes, sometimes deliberately.

Compounding that, people have their own opinions and agendas, and if that wasn't enough, so too do the papers they work for. Who then have their own agenda, and then ultimately the controller of the news group (eg, Murdoch, et al).

Compounding that further, the Government have their own agenda, which can also affect the controller of the newsgroup.

It's a murky pool and no mistaking !

Perhaps the only way is to try and muddle through the various reports and see if you can eliminate the bs from the facts, however that's easier said than done, and is an acquired skill which I would assume most of the population do not possess.

Consequently, that leaves the majority of people in the country, if not the world, in a readily malleable state.

Which gives cause for concern in itself, wouldn't you think ?

1st : Afterthought : Mentioning the ability to wade thorough various reports and find the truth. How would you know if you were successful, or had deluded yourself ?

2nd Afterthought : It all comes down to trust, doesn't it ? Would you trust a stranger to report to you the facts of a situation ? How would you easily verify their report ?

3rd Afterthought : Thanks for a stimulating discussion by the way. This is the stuff the old forums were legendary for !

[BlightyBoy]

Reporting the bland facts is like writing a story without passion.

Well that's kinda my point. And I think you have acknowledged this for yourself with the "passion" rhetoric.

Why would you want to "sex-up" the content of your fridge (in your example) unless you wanted to appear more interesting than a simple dullard with coffee and sauce? Reporting with passion can instill that passion into others, this is true, however, shouldn't there be an ethical issue here about with-what and why you are attempting to empassion people?

People who are less intelligent that we two may fail to see the portent of the last line (added, it appears, somewhat as an afterthought) and act solely on the remaining 99% of the story which is about Johnny Foreigner comin' to good ole Blighty and arf-'incin' all the jobs. Which is not a faithful reproduction of the truth.

[Foxy Moron]

However, there's no smoke without a fire, as the saying goes...

Smoke machines?

[Board Game Geek]

Define "responsible journalism" ?

Reporting the bland facts is like writing a story without passion.

Passion "engages" with the audience and delivers the message on an emotional level.

Eg.

Some of the contents of my fridge.

A jar of spicy sauce.
Some filter coffee.

No passion. Factually correct but people want more.

A jar of Reggae Reggae BBQ Sauce, from the brainchild of Levi Roots, the business entrepreneur who appeared on the Hit TV Series, "Dragon's Den". The jar is also personally signed by Mr Roots, at the BBC Good Food Show in 2008, Olympia.

A vacuum-sealed resuable canister of Continental Number 1 E Roast coffee, home ground for an espresso machine. The Copper Kettle Coffee Company provide some of the most flavourful coffee beans at local Farmer's Markets. The E roast is a particularly strong blend, ideal for neat espressos in the morning, as a pick-me-up before starting the day of work.

Which is the more interesting and informative ?

I would suggest that no one would give two hoots about the original contents of my fridge (well some of the contents anway), but the second descriptions expound on the items, and perhaps give some insight as to the things I enjoy, as well as being informative to fellow coffee fiends who may value a personal reccomendation higher than an advert.

[BlightyBoy]

That's a bit like shooting the messenger, IMHO.

The Mail are just reporting on the story, albeit like any paper, they will report it in their own style.

However, there's no smoke without a fire, as the saying goes...

Yeah, OK, but what about responsible journalism.

Oh, now I see - did I really use those two words in the same sentence?!

[Board Game Geek]

aren't the Mail responsible for drumming up national hatreds??

That's a bit like shooting the messenger, IMHO.

The Mail are just reporting on the story, albeit like any paper, they will report it in their own style.

However, there's no smoke without a fire, as the saying goes...

[BlightyBoy]

Didn't the French suffer a similar "scare" a couple of years ago as a right-wing party was gaining popularity with the voting public?

Is this not still, in fact, the case?

Are we concerned because it's right-wing, or because it's happening in Germany?? What about South Africa? United States (KKK and White Supremicists etc.)

I think this is symptomatic of peoples when economies are in decline, they look to blame others for their misfortune - and the current crisis is no different - let us re-examine the "UK swamped by IT foreigners" thread again - aren't the Mail responsible for drumming up national hatreds??

[Board Game Geek]

Alf,

You might want to lay off the waccy baccy mate, because too much will addle your brain and make you simple minded

[AlfredJPruffock]

In Central Europe
Men are marching
Marching on and marching on
Love songs playing in the restaurants



Cities, buildings Banks falling down
Ideal homes falling down
America can Fall today


These pictures I see on the wall
Timeless leaders once stood so tall

Assassin in a hit and run
In the homelands 42nd state


Asia steals a new born son

Evacuees and Refugees
Presidents and Monarchies

Travel round
I travel round

Decadence and Pleasure Towns
Tragedies
luxuries
statues
parks and galleries

[Board Game Geek]

euro

eurot

[EternalOptimist]

They have a reputation for not stopping at the border.

As we used to say:

"Why do the French lines the avenues of Paris with trees?
So the Germans can march in the shade."

The euro will stop them. Thats the whole point of the euro. A great big maginot line of euros.

[BrowneIssue]

Apart from the Germans does anyone care about neo nazis in Germany?

If they want to goose step round Berlin in lederhosen then let them.

They have a reputation for not stopping at the border.

As we used to say:

"Why do the French lines the avenues of Paris with trees?
So the Germans can march in the shade."

[KentPhilip]

Apart from the Germans does anyone care about neo nazis in Germany?

If they want to goose step round Berlin in lederhosen then let them.

The Jews, perhaps?