Reply to: Sterling recovers

[Cyberman]

As usual you ignore stuff that doesn't fit in your crap world view.
If the Germans motor companies are so good why are they going cap in hand to their government?

http://www.motoring.co.za/index.php?...icleId=4716873

In the end the British way is best - you only postpone problems by subsidising industries that should be killed off.
BTW every single expert in the car industry knows that there is excess capacity. The coming recession will mean that there is a lot of consolidation in the industry and that includes the German.
Here's my prediction - 2 or 3 German names will go bust and be bought up by larger rivals.

Just about every company except food retail is going to their government at the moment. Nobody is buying, especially luxury goods, and we have the biggest liquidity crisis in history. You haven't got a clue, as usual, cretin !!

[AtW]

In the end the British way is best - you only postpone problems by subsidising industries that should be killed off.

Who are you to tell other countries what they should kill off? UK killed everything off now apart from civil service that is heavily subsidised, is that the model you want Europe to follow? I doubt they'd like it, they are certainly not as stupid to try to follow it: UK is going to turn into Italy with harsher climate.

BTW every single expert in the car industry knows that there is excess capacity. The coming recession will mean that there is a lot of consolidation in the industry and that includes the German.

Indeed, too many car manufacturers - one of the big 3 in US will go bust, maybe a couple of big ones but still Germany will keep at least 2 big ones, I reckon all of them actually.

[AtW]

If the Germans motor companies are so good why are they going cap in hand to their government?

Who doesn't? They are not stupid - even if things are good but they see opportunity for cheap finance they'd sure as hell ask for it. As soon as banks were bailed everyone else wanted piece of the action.

Instead of picking on german car manufacturers you should focus on UK ones - or even on those foreign manufacturers (including German) that still make cars in the UK, they also want financial help.

Frankly UK itself has no car industry to speak off after Rover was totally decimated (and cost of keeping them was a fraction of cost spent on bank bailouts), so you are really not in position to think that Germany is in trouble - they are but they will handle it, where as UK has lost its car industry almost totally (I don't count cheap assembly of cars without R&D).

[sasguru]

So you think that having manufacturing capacity in USA, which is a big customer, is somehow a bad thing and sign that Germany is losing it's manufacturing?

Hint - they do it to:
a) reduce currency risk
b) save on deliveries
c) this was all setup when their currency was strong (so good time to invest)

This is not bad outsourcing - I would not have minded if UK kept its industry if it was shifted in parts to where the biggest customers are, but reality is that UK given up on industry totally wasted hard work of previous generations, where as Germans (and the French) managed to keep majority of their stuff and they sure as hell will still have it - that's because they have got balls to confront difficult problems and don't jump to quick short term solutions that would pay big Xmas bonus but screw up everyone down the line - in other words they do totally opposite what the City does.

As usual you ignore stuff that doesn't fit in your crap world view.
If the Germans motor companies are so good why are they going cap in hand to their government?

http://www.motoring.co.za/index.php?...icleId=4716873

In the end the British way is best - you only postpone problems by subsidising industries that should be killed off.
BTW every single expert in the car industry knows that there is excess capacity. The coming recession will mean that there is a lot of consolidation in the industry and that includes the German.
Here's my prediction - 2 or 3 German names will go bust and be bought up by larger rivals.

[AtW]

I didn't realise Alabama was in Germany:

http://www.mbusi.com/

Or in fact any of the 21 countries listed in this article:

So you think that having manufacturing capacity in USA, which is a big customer, is somehow a bad thing and sign that Germany is losing it's manufacturing?

Hint - they do it to:
a) reduce currency risk
b) save on deliveries
c) this was all setup when their currency was strong (so good time to invest)

This is not bad outsourcing - I would not have minded if UK kept its industry if it was shifted in parts to where the biggest customers are, but reality is that UK given up on industry totally wasted hard work of previous generations, where as Germans (and the French) managed to keep majority of their stuff and they sure as hell will still have it - that's because they have got balls to confront difficult problems and don't jump to quick short term solutions that would pay big Xmas bonus but screw up everyone down the line - in other words they do totally opposite what the City does.

[sasguru]

Yes VW will probably make more Skodas, but Merc/BMW/Audi will remain in Germany, certainly the top models - carp like "Smart car" might be made somewhere else, just like they make Mini in UK.

I didn't realise Alabama was in Germany:

http://www.mbusi.com/

Or in fact any of the 21 countries listed in this article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz

Why do you think that Merc and BMW can afford to pay their assembly workers 30-40 Euro an hour indefinitely?

http://www.motoring.co.za/index.php?...icleId=4716873

[AtW]

Right. So you agree the market for luxury cars has collapsed all round.

Based on Audi figures that does not appear to be the case but it is plausible to expect BMW/Merc are down.

The important thing that you are missing is that the City sales stopped being top market (apart from local dealers obviously) for some years now - that means you and your buddies don't mean much insofar as alleged luxury cars sales collapse.

I predict the pressure will make them look for cost savings and they will hollow out Germany by moving production to cheaper locations abroad.

Yes VW will probably make more Skodas, but Merc/BMW/Audi will remain in Germany, certainly the top models - carp like "Smart car" might be made somewhere else, just like they make Mini in UK.

[Cyberman]

Right. So you agree the market for luxury cars has collapsed all round.
So where will BMW and Merc sell their stuff now?
I predict the pressure will make them look for cost savings and they will hollow out Germany by moving production to cheaper locations abroad.

People don't spend when they have little disposable income or are worried about their jobs. HMG are responsible for this situation after 11 years of ever-increasing taxes and red tape. The current impass will take a new Tory government to unravel.

[sasguru]

It may suprise you but the City was not a prime market for Porsches and other elite cars - the people who were buying most of them are new rich in countries like Russia - even 10 years ago there were more top of the range (Merc 600S) cars in Moscow than in London, but in the last few years the difference became huge. BMW mainly sells chav 3xx series here - more numerous than Mondeos now, Mercs also sell cheap cars here.

The real issue for these premium manufacturers now is that due to oil/gas/minerals price collapse their new clients ain't going to be buying as many of those cars anytime soon.

Right. So you agree the market for luxury cars has collapsed all round.
So where will BMW and Merc sell their stuff now?
I predict the pressure will make them look for cost savings and they will hollow out Germany by moving production to cheaper locations abroad.

[AtW]

Yes because the Poles and Hungarians are going to start buying the Porsches, Mercs and BMWs that the City boys aren't buying?

It may suprise you but the City was not a prime market for Porsches and other elite cars - the people who were buying most of them are new rich in countries like Russia - even 10 years ago there were more top of the range (Merc 600S) cars in Moscow than in London, but in the last few years the difference became huge. BMW mainly sells chav 3xx series here - more numerous than Mondeos now, Mercs also sell cheap cars here.

The real issue for these premium manufacturers now is that due to oil/gas/minerals price collapse their new clients ain't going to be buying as many of those cars anytime soon.

[sasguru]

I am off now to see my legal team.

one-man band solicitor with an office above a kebab shop.

Isn't it sweet how atw tries to play the big tycoon when we all know what a shambling buffoon he really is

[Mich the Tester]

Yes because the Poles and Hungarians are going to start buying the Porsches, Mercs and BMWs that the City boys aren't buying?

Yes, BMWs are very popular among the executives of Eastern European personal entertainment chemicals brokerages and adult comfort service providers; two examples of anti-cyclical industries.

[BrilloPad]

no - no more laughs please. My sides are splitting already with the tripe these two are coming out with.

Its christmas : we all need a laugh.

[PM-Junkie]

I hope you are going to tell them everyone says your economic theories are s**t. And they sue. I could do with a laugh....

no - no more laughs please. My sides are splitting already with the tripe these two are coming out with.

[sasguru]

Eatern states to Western Europe (apart from UK) will play role of colonies and help ride out this storm - this will help keep more manufacturing inside EU. UK will be shafted either way, it is just a wishful thinking for some to think eurozone will suffer as long or as much as UK will.

Yes because the Poles and Hungarians are going to start buying the Porsches, Mercs and BMWs that the City boys aren't buying?

Your idiocy gets more extreme by the minute