Reply to: Happy Atheist day!

[Ruprect]

(I don't think I am, since I'm not pretending to be anything I'm not except to those who are holding up religion as a barrier.)

If it is hypocrisy, I can live with it. What I couldn't live with is holding my own beliefs above the future opportunities of my children and denying them acccess to a decent education for the sake of not telling a porky to the local cleric.

Do you actually have kids Ruprect?

Yep, 2. Don't get me wrong, I understand completely why you (and thousands like you) do it, but it propogates a 2 tier education system that denies many parents who all pay their fair share of tax (), giving the "religious" a better chance than the non. And that is fundamentally wrong.

[AtW]

BTW I'm agnostic, so I'm not trying to convert you to belief in anything.

I was more agnostic than atheist myself, however recently I started moving towards atheism insofar as Russian affairs are concerned - Western Christianity is more or less acceptable, but Russian is very aggressive and oppressive flavour.

Too many current world problems are due to religions - the only way to address root cause of problems is to deal with religions, and the first step would be prohibition of teaching this stuff to children.

[TheBigYinJames]

So if I strapped explosives to myself and blown up a bunch of civilians, would that have made things better? I think not.

That's got nothing to do with the existence of god, any more than any act of human idiocy has.

Have you ever considered that atheism is a religious faith? An active belief in the nonexistence of god with no substantive proof is just as wide-eyed and raving as any theist fervour. The fact that you are getting angry with me about it tells it all. When people are sure about things, there is no need to shout. It's only when there's uncertainty, as with atheism, that people start getting shouty and desk thumpy when people disagree.

BTW I'm agnostic, so I'm not trying to convert you to belief in anything.

[AtW]

It shows.

So if I strapped explosives to myself and blown up a bunch of civilians, would that have shown that I had "edukasion" thingy and therefore qualified to speak on the subject? I think not.

[TheBigYinJames]

No I have not had any religions education, thank you very much.

It shows.

[AtW]

have you actually had any religious education?

No I have not had any religions education, thank you very much.

Have you ever thought that if religions were held to fraud (and obtaining money by deception) legislation they'd all be disbanded and their members be doing long jail sentences?

I don't have a problem with some key things like not to steal, not to murder etc, that's fine by me however a number of other things usually have very negative impact - the only way to have a chance of stopping this madness is to prevent new members being acquired by those religions - this means putting a stop to brainwashing of children, so hopefully in a few generations most of problems associated with religions will go away.

The Christianity is more mild these days then before, however if this problem is to be solved you can't just target Islam but all religions - even Buddism that I think is pretty mild. The west is lucky that Mohammad did not land there.

[cailin maith]

have you actually had any religious education? Nobody is made to believe anything (such a concept is ludicrous anyway)

True - I went to convent schools, primary and secondary (Presentation Sisters ) And even we knew the immaculate conception was a load of old toss... maybe back in the time before the 60's it was like AtW thinks but in the recent past it's not the case.

[TheBigYinJames]

they certainly should not be allowed to be made belive in stuff that defies common sense.

have you actually had any religious education? Nobody is made to believe anything (such a concept is ludicrous anyway)

[AtW]

when they reach an age to really understand what they were doing, want to change their religion, I wouldn't stand in their way. However, for my own peace of mind and my own faith, I'd want them baptised.

There should be at least 16 years minimum (better 18 or even 21) age for any religion studies. If someone is not allowed to smoke or drink beer they certainly should not be allowed to be made belive in stuff that defies common sense.

There would have been a lot less violence in the world if religions played no role, well maybe Buddhism would have actually been pretty positive.

It's ridiculous really - parents are not allowed to smack misbehaving children, yet they are allowed to brainwash them with rubbish that will cause untold problems in the future.

[cailin maith]

Glad I wasn't baptised.

I mean, what right does a parent have to baptise a baby / child, when aforementioned child has not had its' own chance to make a choice ?

Hmmmnnn - It's a tough one.... for me I would want my kid babptised and if when they reach an age to really understand what they were doing, want to change their religion, I wouldn't stand in their way. However, for my own peace of mind and my own faith, I'd want them baptised.

[TheBigYinJames]

I would say that is a help. And you are being hypocritical; sorry, but you are.

(I don't think I am, since I'm not pretending to be anything I'm not except to those who are holding up religion as a barrier.)

If it is hypocrisy, I can live with it. What I couldn't live with is holding my own beliefs above the future opportunities of my children and denying them acccess to a decent education for the sake of not telling a porky to the local cleric.

Do you actually have kids Ruprect?

[Ruprect]

Tell me what I can do about it? All that would happen is that they would close down faith schools, helping nobody.

I'm not being a hypocrite. I'm being pragmatic. i don't believe in Object Orientation either, but if I want a job that needs it, it's the best thing since sliced bread.

Well, 1000s of kids wouldn't be brainwashed into believing that there is a supernatural power that they must obey watching their every move and willing to send them to hell for transgressions against their "sacred" texts... I would say that is a help. And you are being hypocritical; sorry, but you are.

[TheBigYinJames]

I mean, what right does a parent have to baptise a baby / child, when aforementioned child has not had its' own chance to make a choice ?

Since it's all rubbish anyway, it makes no difference.

[TheBigYinJames]

[QUOTE=Ruprect;642251
I totally understand why people do it, it just frustrates me so much that no one is willing to do anything about it.[/QUOTE]

Tell me what I can do about it? All that would happen is that they would close down faith schools, helping nobody.

I'm not being a hypocrite. I'm being pragmatic. i don't believe in Object Orientation either, but if I want a job that needs it, it's the best thing since sliced bread.

[bogeyman]

Glad I wasn't baptised.

You'll go straight to Hell now. You know that, don't you.