Reply to: Descartes and dualism

[expat]

How does one separate the mind from the body and is this really possible ?

Or is it possible not to? Easily, I'd say. So (as always) the psychological question behind the philosophy remains: why does everybody see the body and mind as a duality? If I said that the body-mind problem is not really a problem at all, you might hear me out, but you wouldn't really believe it.

This compares with Hume's second question on inference: why do people believe it works? (though he automatically fell into his own trap: why did Hume feel able to say that people believe in inference? Because he had seen them do so in the past, so he assumed they would in the future...)

[Rebecca Loos]

maybe. But it is not just a question of size, is it? What about firmness?
Anyway I digress: any test designed to measure intelligence is doomed to fail as any person failing it can always practice it and get better next time round.

[Jabberwocky]

So there we are, having fun between ourselves, harmless to the great and the good of this world, and suddenly the great and the good decide to have a look at what we do, do not like it, and tell us to get back to our bananas?
Sorry mate, we were here first. Please go back to your intellectual high ground and leave the floor to those with a total lack of moral fortitude. Thank you

Have you got big jugs too ?

What has always worried me about the chinese room is that Searle says that the database guy looking up chinese expressions is clearly not doing things intelligently and yet he passes the Turing test. He is arguing that intelligence is more than just database retrieval - and yet he doesn't have a definition of what intelligence actually is - he gives no mechanism.

[Rebecca Loos]

These are the sort of juvenile reponses that substantiate my point. The stuff on here is banal drivel, I am really wasted on you lot. The baboons on here should get back to their bananas and leave the intellectual high ground to those with moral fortitude.

So there we are, having fun between ourselves, harmless to the great and the good of this world, and suddenly the great and the good decide to have a look at what we do, do not like it, and tell us to get back to our bananas?
Sorry mate, we were here first. Please go back to your intellectual high ground and leave the floor to those with a total lack of moral fortitude. Thank you

[threaded]

Bagpuss: Well, Descartes had some interesting ideas on language, such as assigning a number to a letter, phoneme, word which is used in cryptography, and cryptography was one of the forces to produce the first electronic computer.

[Bagpuss]

I wonder if the computer would have been invented if we didnt have cartesian coordinates

[WageSlave]

Unfortunately, I'm forced to believe that the mind and the brain are one and the same.

Why unfortunately? And how could it be otherwise?

Why unfortunate? Simply because I'm a romantic at heart and always liked to believe in the create soul. However, the more I read and thought about it, the more I became a materialist.
How could it be otherwise? That's the reason for my 'conversion'!

[sasguru]

If jabberwocky was serious and intelligent enough to discuss the issues rather than regurgitating some inadequately digested ideas, this could be an interesting discussion. Unfortunately he's a few years behind current thinking.
Modern neuroscience is slowly building up a body of evidence to show that the mind and brain are one and the same and that we're rather more nature than nuture. Regarding the Turing test, Chinese room argument etc, it's pretty obvious that there's a difference between syntax and semantics. Theoretically, why couldn't a computer behave like Hal in 2001? That is the ultimate strong AI. The answer is that we don't know yet.

[Dundeegeorge]

Do what?

Unfortunately, I'm forced to believe that the mind and the brain are one and the same.

Why unfortunately? And how could it be otherwise?

[WageSlave]

Am I too late for all the bottom baring? Finally forced to do some work and while I'm away everyone's getting their arses out Oh well

I've always liked Searle's Chinese room argument. But is it really valid? Marvin Minsky would argue it isn't; it's trying to reduce consciousness to a single concept. Unfortunately, I'm forced to believe that the mind and the brain are one and the same. Now, back to the bare arses please.

[Bagpuss]

These are the sort of juvenile reponses that substantiate my point. The stuff on here is banal drivel, I am really wasted on you lot. The baboons on here should get back to their bananas and leave the intellectual high ground to those with moral fortitude. There are only a couple of people here I respect: Chico for his religious convection and Sandy for her big jugs.

They don't do a philosophy for dummies book yet!

[The Lone Gunman]

These are the sort of juvenile reponses that substantiate my point. The stuff on here is banal drivel, I am really wasted on you lot. The baboons on here should get back to their bananas and leave the intellectual high ground to those with moral fortitude. There are only a couple of people here I respect: Chico for his religious convection and Sandy for her big jugs.

Yes but, like Chico, you never give us any of your own ideas, only regurgitate cut n paste googles.

What do you think of the chinese room as opposed to turing? What are your thoughts on dualism and the seperation of the mind and body?

Why didnt you answer my posts on socialism?

Once more, to give you a fighting chance.
The Chinese room defines the Turing experiment more clearly in that it states that the person in the room follows a predefined programme where all the answers are known before hand.
The inplication from Turing is that the computer is a "proper" AI, in that it is not preprogrammed with all the answers, but that it works them out.

The seperation of mind and body is difficult, clearly a mind needs a residence, though not necessarily fully functional eg Steven Hawking.

[sasguru]

It is funny how the male baboon when confronted with superior wit just resorts to derrogatory invective.

O great geezer of superior wit, learn to spell.

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz....

[Jabberwocky]

It is funny how the male baboon when confronted with superior wit just resorts to derrogatory invective.

[Jabberwocky]

>Chico for his religous convection - Yeah, he's full of hot air!

well spotted spud - thanks for spelling it out to the other members of your baboon troop.