Be nice to your HSMP worker

[SueEllen]

A friend of mine is a train driver.

He works incredibly unsocial hours and bizarre shifts.
He is under constant D&A random testing and therefore cannot drink.
His job is extremely high pressure and requires a lot of skill, training (no pun intended) and responsibility.

That is why they are paid more. For a difficult and demanding job that is directly responsible for public safety, and for their skill and indirect opportunity to have a social life.

Not deriding train drivers but one of the reasons they are paid so much is due to rail privatisation. When the railways where broken up no company wanted to train drivers and they retired lots of the older ones off, which lead to a shortage of drivers. This pushed salaries up for the rest.

With healthcare workers when there is a shortage the government targets recruitment at other countries which helps to keep salaries down but deprives those countries (normally developing countries) of their workers.

This has also been done with teachers to lesser success. I use to know a lot of Austrialia and kiwi teachers who would work here for 2-3 years while the pound was strong but realised they could not settle in the South East due to their wages.

And no one in their right mind would work as a scientist in this country. The pay for the amount of qualifications they need is s****. I know a lot of people with scientific PhDs who are employed elsewhere as they like being able to live to a decent standard.

[SizeZero]

A friend of mine is a train driver.

He works incredibly unsocial hours and bizarre shifts.
He is under constant D&A random testing and therefore cannot drink.
His job is extremely high pressure and requires a lot of skill, training (no pun intended) and responsibility.

That is why they are paid more. For a difficult and demanding job that is directly responsible for public safety, and for their skill and indirect opportunity to have a social life.

So, a bit like a (degree qualified) nurse then, only on twice the salary of a nurse?

[BrilloPad]

you clearly respect train drivers over softies

This country is only interested in the cult of celebrity. Anything cerebal is out.

Anyone who watches big brother or reads the sun should be deprived the vote. then birched. twice.

[The Lone Gunman]

I wasnt deriding train drivers. Just using them as an example.
I would suggest nurses and police officers could lay claim to similar rates.

What I am saying is that I think rates for IT are pitiful. Particularly when you consider BAe Systems is responsible for much of our defence equipment. Civil aircraft, nuclear power systems and rail safety equipment offers much the same rates.
Dont want to go off on one, but have said many times.
No wonder projects fail. Low rates, no status (you clearly respect train drivers over softies) etc.

[Board Game Geek]

A train driver earns 40K. Average salaries for Software Engineers at British Aerospace is about 27K.

A friend of mine is a train driver.

He works incredibly unsocial hours and bizarre shifts.
He is under constant D&A random testing and therefore cannot drink.
His job is extremely high pressure and requires a lot of skill, training (no pun intended) and responsibility.

That is why they are paid more. For a difficult and demanding job that is directly responsible for public safety, and for their skill and indirect opportunity to have a social life.

[sasguru]

I will assume, that due to your profession, you know what you are talking about on rates, BUT...... A train driver earns 40K. Average salaries for Software Engineers at British Aerospace is about 27K.

Spivving

Yeah but we don't need any real industry, don't you know?
We can all cut each other's hair, drive each other around and paint each others toenails for cash.

[DodgyAgent]

I will assume, that due to your profession, you know what you are talking about on rates, .

[The Lone Gunman]

So being paid on average 20% more than equivalent "professionals" from other areas of engineering and having access to a huge market of contract work, that pays fantastic money for bu**er all commitment is tantamount to exploitation is it?

Try telling that to:

Other engineers,
Nurses,
teachers,
any other trade or profession (with the exception of plumbers... maybe)
and of course the poorest of all... recruitment consultants.

I will assume, that due to your profession, you know what you are talking about on rates, BUT...... A train driver earns 40K. Average salaries for Software Engineers at British Aerospace is about 27K.

[DodgyAgent]

right, lets have a whip round for dodgy

Thanks EO, you are too kind. I do need a new whip to get my lazy contractors to put in some more time

[EternalOptimist]

So being paid on average 20% more than equivalent "professionals" from other areas of engineering and having access to a huge market of contract work, that pays fantastic money for bu**er all commitment is tantamount to exploitation is it?

Try telling that to:

Other engineers,
Nurses,
teachers,
any other trade or profession (with the exception of plumbers... maybe)
and of course the poorest of all... recruitment consultants.

right, lets have a whip round for dodgy

[DodgyAgent]

"The Work Foundation said skilled migrants were needed in areas such as science, healthcare and technology."

Maybe if technology workers were treated properly it would encourage british people to enter the profession.

So being paid on average 20% more than equivalent "professionals" from other areas of engineering and having access to a huge market of contract work, that pays fantastic money for bu**er all commitment is tantamount to exploitation is it?

Try telling that to:

Other engineers,
Nurses,
teachers,
any other trade or profession (with the exception of plumbers... maybe)
and of course the poorest of all... recruitment consultants.

[BrilloPad]

Link

"The Work Foundation said skilled migrants were needed in areas such as science, healthcare and technology."

Maybe if technology workers were treated properly it would encourage british people to enter the profession.

[Troll]

Hostility towards immigrants could stop companies attracting highly-skilled workers from abroad, a report has said.

The Work Foundation said skilled migrants were needed in areas such as science, healthcare and technology.

Report author Katerina Rudiger said the UK needed to be seen as an open and attractive place for skilled employees.

Meanwhile, campaigners Migrationwatch say government figures show just 8% of 2.3 million immigrants in the past 16 years came from Eastern Europe.

'Limit work permits'

The Work Foundation said despite the high-profile immigration debate, the number of skilled workers moving to the UK was "relatively low".

It said official figures showed 167,000 highly-skilled workers came to the UK in 2005, but more were needed if Britain was to prosper in a global market.

But Sir Andrew Green, chairman of Migrationwatch, told BBC Radio 4's Today programme a cap should be introduced to limit the length of work permits to four years.

If we are going to say, 'You can come for four years, then you're out' why would anyone try to make a long-term future in UK industry?

This, he said, would provide a "proper incentive" to British employers to train British workers.

"At the moment, if you can take a skilled worker off the shelf, you are going to do so, obviously, especially if your competitors are going to do so," Sir Andrew said.

Link