Reply to: Stupid use of technology rant

[expat]

In that case, you need OEM.

The DBA needs OEM to tune the database. The developer needs TOAD to tune the SQL, indexes, etc.

[TheFaQQer]

Not quite. It won't do run-time stats by itself. Otherwise I do like SQL Developer better, it's cleaner. But if you're doing serious tuning it doesn't have all that you need.

In that case, you need OEM.

[expat]

Nope - banking.

It was an integration hub, plus CRM front-end, plus separate back-end system on Oracle.

Incredibly extendable and flexible, and cheap at half the price.

SQL Developer (AKA Project Raptor) does everything that TOAD does, for free.

Not quite. It won't do run-time stats by itself. Otherwise I do like SQL Developer better, it's cleaner. But if you're doing serious tuning it doesn't have all that you need.

[TheFaQQer]

No doubt it's a government project then, where they throw money down black holes like Gazza does kebabs?

15 million for a database.

You even need to use a Toad to administer it as Oracle's own tools are absolute tulipe.

Nope - banking.

It was an integration hub, plus CRM front-end, plus separate back-end system on Oracle.

Incredibly extendable and flexible, and cheap at half the price.

SQL Developer (AKA Project Raptor) does everything that TOAD does, for free.

[expat]

Not everything is priced like that. Some products, if not all, are available on a per user basis or per concurrent user basis.

Yeah, per user is a good one. Use it for a Siebel application, and Siebel (part of Oracle) insist that you never ever delete a user. So Fred quits and is replaced by Joe, you naturally define a user for Joe, but you have to keep Fred's old user forever. And Oracle charge you for it.


PS AtW, I know you wouldn't use Siebel.

[PRC1964]

They are desperate now for revenues.

Maybe. But that's no reason why not to take advantage.

[AtW]

If you ask them nicely Sun will do you some very good deals on hardware. We are in the process of getting some serious kit for not much wonga.

They are desperate now for revenues.

[PRC1964]

Oracle is a rip off. Just like Sun.

If you ask them nicely Sun will do you some very good deals on hardware. We are in the process of getting some serious kit for not much wonga.

[AtW]

No doubt it's a government project then, where they throw money down black holes like Gazza does kebabs?

Bazza like

[PAH]

Oracle took £15 million

No doubt it's a government project then, where they throw money down black holes like Gazza does kebabs?

15 million for a database.

You even need to use a Toad to administer it as Oracle's own tools are absolute tulipe.

[AtW]

Not everything is priced like that. Some products, if not all, are available on a per user basis or per concurrent user basis.

Yes this is true. I would not go Oracle route however, not least because I much prefer T-SQL (good old Sybase and MS SQL), but for the kind of prices they charge I would not use Oracle at all, I'd rather save this money and put them into something useful, sorry Oracle DBAs...

[TheFaQQer]

Have you seen how they were pricing it? By power-units ffs, so if you got more powerful machine you have to pay more, wtf? It's like tax effectively.

Not everything is priced like that. Some products, if not all, are available on a per user basis or per concurrent user basis.

[AtW]

Yeah, Larry should just give it away. Like SKA

Have you seen how they were pricing it? By power-units ffs, so if you got more powerful machine you have to pay more, wtf? It's like tax effectively.

[oracleslave]

Oracle is a rip off. Just like Sun.

Yeah, Larry should just give it away. Like SKA

[AtW]

Problem was with the first phase of development, which was budgeted at about £5 million and Oracle took £15 million. Meant that all that the consultancy could spend on the next bit was £300k. It was undoubtedly cheaper than that, but that's all that they offered us to build the all singing, all dancing solution to integrate web front end to messaging hub to back office and back again.

Oracle is a rip off. Just like Sun.