Reply to: Watching BBC

[AtW]

if it can be demonstrated that they could benefit from such a regime

I can demonstrate that you will benefit from a tough but fair military regime

[Denny]

I am not suggesting this. I am suggesting that these people are seriously broken for whatever reason and they need some serious help - army on a far frontier will either make them stronger or they die trying to fight their condition. Either way it is fine - better die fighting then slowly die whilst giving up. I reckon when those people found themselves surrounded by Taliban they will want to live and will fight back and ultimately get back their life.

Not opposed to the idea of some sort of disciplined structured environment to help the long term unemployed regain or even gain for the first time some self respect and morale, if it can be demonstrated that they could benefit from such a regime, but I don't think the military is the answer. It certainly isn't the answer for all long term unemployed either.

You have to think of the regular military personnel who have to work alongside these people. How will their morale be affected if they think the military is conveniently being used as a dumping ground for all those society have written off as rejects and losers who are deemed to need a 'kick up the backside' to get their life in order?

One thing the miltary rankings do not need, particularly now, is less morale than they currently have. Conditions are already at an all time low - with inadequate equipment to fight in battle, poor housing conditions for their families, inadequate compensation and even hospital treatement when injured in battle (now they've taken away military hospitals) and generally bad pay for what they do. Add 'unemployed losers' to the mix and the regulars who joined voluntarily and who have pride in what they do will surely think they are being regarded as mugs who are ill appreciated rather than being thought of as a group of highly skilled and brave individuals who the rest of us rely on to keep us safe from foreign invasion.

[AtW]

I suppose you'd bring back the workhouse and make the homeless or unemployed work 18 hours a day for a bowl of watery gruel and a slice of stale bread.

I am not suggesting this. I am suggesting that these people are seriously broken for whatever reason and they need some serious help - army on a far frontier will either make them stronger or they die trying to fight their condition. Either way it is fine - better die fighting then slowly die whilst giving up. I reckon when those people found themselves surrounded by Taliban they will want to live and will fight back and ultimately get back their life.

[Denny]

And there is a charity briefing there for those who help homeless people, and the instructor tells participants about food options - there is meat option, vegeterian option etc.

The question is this - if you are homeless and hungry, how the heck can you reasonably expect to get veggi option? I mean if you are hungry and homeless then you should be grateful to get ANY food, if I was in this position I would certainly think this way.

I suppose you'd bring back the workhouse and make the homeless or unemployed work 18 hours a day for a bowl of watery gruel and a slice of stale bread.

You've read too many Dickens novels.

[NoddY]

Possibly institutionalising some people will give them a sense of security, be that hospital or the army. However, some people can be so misanthropic that they will never integrate into any kind of society and I feel it's important not to impose our general will upon them - they have after all opted out. And who says our, i.e. western society's, way of doing things is the blueprint to social harmony?

[AtW]

I feel some people need things the state cannot provide and that's the help and attention of people around them who care for them.

Draft them into the army - there they will get all attention they need.

Personally I dodged (legally) Russian army draft, but I would not have minded to serve in the British army, if it was not for work that I can't drop right now.

Unemployed people should get benefits in exchange of doing free work for the state, like say picking up rubbish etc.

[NoddY]

I am familiar with this subject. Our family was poor, but with hard work and some luck my parents changed that.

When it comes to UK it seems strange for me to have homeless people here, why ain't they getting social housing? If their will is totally broke and they can't beat habit of drugs/drinks, then they need serious help in form of forced hospitalisation to ensure they beat the habit or die fighting it.

While the state should provide assistance, I feel some people need things the state cannot provide and that's the help and attention of people around them who care for them. The state can never be a surrogate for the family.

[AtW]

BTW if you have been in Russia for any extended period , you should have familiarity with the subject - poor person.

I am familiar with this subject. Our family was poor, but with hard work and some luck my parents changed that.

When it comes to UK it seems strange for me to have homeless people here, why ain't they getting social housing? If their will is totally broke and they can't beat habit of drugs/drinks, then they need serious help in form of forced hospitalisation to ensure they beat the habit or die fighting it.

[2uk]

Perhaps homeless people should be drafted into the army: they will get food, shelter and, if they are good, they will live long to enjoy it.

That pretty much is the ppl that signed up in the army to go to IRAQ. Watch Loose Change.

BTW if you have been in Russia for any extended period , you should have familiarity with the subject - poor person. You can't summarize poor people in 2 sentences. There is saying - Poor person - pure devil.

[AtW]

Perhaps homeless people should be drafted into the army: they will get food, shelter and, if they are good, they will live long to enjoy it.

[TimberWolf]

"I heard tale of him teaching the army survival techniques and being miffed when they stole gear from his truck."

You have to be an utter dirt to steal from people who are trying to help you.

I can understand stealing to survive, but steal when people try to help you? They, allegedly, stole his gear, did they need it for survival? Most likely not - they'd sell it to get booze or drugs.

Yeah, those guys took survival seriously, though there may have been some joviality involved, I don't know the whole story. Perhaps Mears learnt a lesson too, i.e. that survival situations aren't like on the telly.

[AtW]

You really are a ****. What has homeless got to do with being a thief.

"I heard tale of him teaching the army survival techniques and being miffed when they stole gear from his truck."

You have to be an utter dirt to steal from people who are trying to help you.

I can understand stealing to survive, but steal when people try to help you? They, allegedly, stole his gear, did they need it for survival? Most likely not - they'd sell it to get booze or drugs.

[Sockpuppet]

Maybe Sharia law stipulating that thiefs get their hands cut off is not such a bad idea after all.

You really are a ****. What has homeless got to do with being a thief.

[TimberWolf]

Maybe Sharia law stipulating that thiefs get their hands cut off is not such a bad idea after all.

If you are in a survival situation, stealing is survival.

[AtW]

It was 'explained' to him that was the way to survive in survival situations.

Maybe Sharia law stipulating that thiefs get their hands cut off is not such a bad idea after all.