Reply to: Mancs to get congestion charge

[richard-af]

James Bond-like revolving number plates - there's a gap in the market, I think.

[dang65]

Poxy argument.
Why should drivers pay for a system that is for everybody's benefit?

No, no, it's for the drivers' benefit. People who aren't drivers already use public transport, or walk, or cycle. Research has shown that drivers cannot stop using their cars because someone needs to sort out the public transport system in this country first. So, do you see, someone is sorting out the public transport for you so you won't be forced to use your cars any more. Of course, you won't mind paying for it because it's what you want.

Isn't it?

[The Lone Gunman]

The official idea is that the congestion charge is meant to raise money, in conjunction with the government's Transport Innovation Fund, which will pay for the kind of improvements to public transport which everyone says they need before they can possibly stop using their cars.

They don't want to price people out of cars before there is suitable public transport to replace the cars with, but they do have to get a stream of income in order to qualify for TIF money.

So, keeping the charge quite low will allow people to afford to keep driving everywhere, but at the same time they will be directly contributing to Manchester's future public transport system, which addresses another thing everyone moans about in regard to current taxation.

This leaves drivers with nothing at all to moan about, so it'll be nice to see them with big, contented smiles on their faces from now on.

Poxy argument.
Why should drivers pay for a system that is for everybodies benefit? Put the increase on local council tax and let the residents pay for it.

Then put punative congestion charges in place and ban any vehicles other than public transport from city centre roads.

Drivers are already paying billions more into the treasury than is spent on them. Why cant that money be spent on the transport infrastructure?
HMG and Councils alike consistantly tell us they can not ring fence distinct incomes against distinct costs. How come they can (conveniently) with congestion charging?

It is another dip in the pockets of motorists who do not have a choice.

[wendigo100]

... that I don't fully understand the congestion charge thingy.

I take it that it's a complete thieving farce? Please enlighten me.

Yes, it hits those on lowest incomes hardest.

Unfortunately, to get around that, we'll probably end up with Council Tax Credits or some such nonsense.

[dang65]

The official idea is that the congestion charge is meant to raise money, in conjunction with the government's Transport Innovation Fund, which will pay for the kind of improvements to public transport which everyone says they need before they can possibly stop using their cars.

They don't want to price people out of cars before there is suitable public transport to replace the cars with, but they do have to get a stream of income in order to qualify for TIF money.

So, keeping the charge quite low will allow people to afford to keep driving everywhere, but at the same time they will be directly contributing to Manchester's future public transport system, which addresses another thing everyone moans about in regard to current taxation.

This leaves drivers with nothing at all to moan about, so it'll be nice to see them with big, contented smiles on their faces from now on.

[pisces]

That's a good point

[Churchill]

... that I don't fully understand the congestion charge thingy.

I take it that it's a complete thieving farce? Please enlighten me.

It's supposed to be a deterrent against using your car. Use your car, pay a fiver. However, if they really wanted it to be a deterrent and not the cash cow that it really is they should've set the charge at 500 quid a day.

[richard-af]

Maybe It's Because I'm Not A Londoner...

... that I don't fully understand the congestion charge thingy.

I take it that it's a complete thieving farce? Please enlighten me.

[KathyWoolfe]

The answer is quite simple: put a tax on parking in the centre of congested towns and cities, and put the profit towards park-and-ride and public transport.

Since when has the profit on anything been put towards anything for the public good?
The Road Fund Licence - which we all pay, right? - was "supposed" to go towards improving the roads and also improving public transport.
Instead it goes into the general taxation pot.

[Alf W]

What will happen to the value of houses within a 5-10 minute walk of a train station straight into the city centre?

[OwlHoot]

What is the point in that? Surely most people live inside the outer ring road and would be exempt from the charge?!

For now ..

It's the oldest trick in the book: Start with a big discount, to keep the plebs happy thinking they have a bargain, and then year by year increase it. For instance, a pound to a pinch of pig sh*t says the London discounted charge will go up from £1 per day to £2 per day next year.

[richard-af]

Big difference in cities I reckon. London being a major player in the finacial market and just about everything else means everyone just had to swallow it. Manchester won't be the same, a lot of people will seek jobs outside of the city. It could well backfire

The cops were pretty hot stuff at towing away cars when I lived in Manc about 10 years ago. Cost a fortune to get 'em back.

[pisces]

I'm not too familiar with Manchester, but a CC would kill trade in the city centre. This is why other cities haven't rushed to copy London so far (as initially predicted).

The answer is quite simple: put a tax on parking in the centre of congested towns and cities, and put the profit towards park-and-ride and public transport.

Big difference in cities I reckon. London being a major player in the finacial market and just about everything else means everyone just had to swallow it. Manchester won't be the same, a lot of people will seek jobs outside of the city. It could well backfire

[dang65]

Congestion charges? Does that apply to a bunged-up nose, too?

Yes, you'll have to use a public hankey now.

[richard-af]

Congestion charges? Does that apply to a bunged-up nose, too?