Reply to: Predictions for changes once Brown has settled in

[hyperD]

Tulip me Spacecadet "tuliping in a tube carriage man"...good spot...

What we realised a year ago still stands...

As I said, the only "virtual" power that mcBroon ever had was the perception of the economy doing well. It's not, and as Jebus said : "and it shall come to pass"...

“It is easier for a biryani to pass through the eye of a rectum than for a poor man to realise the benefits of the tax credit system (Luke 18:25)”

[Spacecadet]

topical bump

[Rantor]

The thing is Hyper.. there is a vacuum waiting to be filled. He and his advisors are so detached from reality they think mimicing New Labour is the answer. If they actually listened to real people they would know there is a hunger for something different. Cameron has an ease about him that Gordo can only dream of if only he had some weapons. He has the capability to destroy brown, he just can't see it. So he comes across as a nice bloke with nothing new to say, until that changes it will be more of the same ad infinitum

Brown is not to be underestimated - I think he will outflank cameron on most issues and will have no qualms about painting Cameron as being a wooly centrist on 'tough' topics.

Cameron also has his mob barely under control and a lot of their activists are way, way out of line with him.

I'm no tory but I remember Major saying the tories had stretched the elastic of democracy as far as it would go - I always liked that analogy. On the basis of the war and bigging up the state I think NL have already reached that point. If Brown sees off Cameron then what hope of any decent parlimentary opposition for the next decade

[shaunbhoy]

The thing is Hyper.. there is a vacuum waiting to be filled. He and his advisors are so detached from reality they think mimicing New Labour is the answer. If they actually listened to real people they would know there is a hunger for something different. Cameron has an ease about him that Gordo can only dream of if only he had some weapons. He has the capability to destroy brown, he just can't see it. So he comes across as a nice bloke with nothing new to say, until that changes it will be more of the same ad infinitum

Cameron is wise to play his cards so close to his chest. Because all of the main parties are busy stepping on each others' feet trying to hold the "middle ground" there is little room for maneouvre. More importantly Cameron has realised that NL only came to power by lurching to the right and adopting too many policies that would previously have been the preserve of the Tories. If Cameron gives away too much detail of what he has in mind too soon before another election then NL will simply purloin it and repackage it as their own. He will do well to let them meander downhill in the ratings then announce to the electorate in the run-up to the next election what his vision really is, hopefully when it is too late for NL to steal his ideas and pass them off as their own as they have done for the last few years.
Remember you heard it here first

SB in "cutting to the chase" mode

[hyperD]

Yes, agree with that. One can only hope someone in Team Cameron can see this and get out there before brown tries to grab that idea for his own.

[BoredBloke]

My something different would be somebody who showed a bit of passion. Somebody who would actually lose it from time to time and spoke the truth. He would never get voted in, but at least it would be somebody you could relate to.

Somebody who would start a point on Question Time with "I'll tell you about your bloody Labour Party shall I....................."

But then that would give gay boy another chunk of time at number 10 to nick more of my moeny

[Bagpuss]

The thing is Hyper.. there is a vacuum waiting to be filled. He and his advisors are so detached from reality they think mimicing New Labour is the answer. If they actually listened to real people they would know there is a hunger for something different. Cameron has an ease about him that Gordo can only dream of if only he had some weapons. He has the capability to destroy brown, he just can't see it. So he comes across as a nice bloke with nothing new to say, until that changes it will be more of the same ad infinitum

[King Cnvt]

Think not what your government can do for you, but what you can do for yourself, without being taxed or imprisoned.

That's my motto.

Talking about politics in the UK is pretty pointless.

[Jog On]

I've started a discussion on the labour message board about contracting, tax, IR35 and billionaires paying less than their cleaners. Feel free to chip in:

http://www.labour.org.uk/current_theme

[hyperD]

The problem is when the soundbite accusation of Cameron not standing for anything is used.. Howard et al are snookered because they can't say, well actually he would do this or that. The best they can say is he stands for community spirit, self reliance, and green issues, or some such meaningless bollocks. The issues which would attract voters are largely disguarded in a misguided attempt to be more holier (or PC) than thou or mimic the policies of the other parties.

Hmmmm, I am worried about the conservatives. They have positioned themselves as “heirs to bliar” in the assumption that people are happy with the middle ground. Yet brown has just announced a speech where he will defend the “British way of life”. I think the tories have been neatly sidestepped by the liebour spin doctors and pr machine to be a carbon copy bliar, whereas brown is being painted as the antidote to the mood of the British people: immigration, for instance.

It’s quite a clever trick: link discussions of immigration to racism and then prevent the tories from using this in their election campaign. Then when the mood of the public flips over to a critical mass of disapproval, then ditch bliar and create a new idol brown who is sympathetic with the public and will start to address these matters. The tories have been stymied and if they start talking about stricter immigration controls, they will be branded as hypocrites and “flop flop” merchants again.

liebour's pr machine is formidable and is in full control of the media. Imagine a bliar leading the party without the millstone of Iraq around his neck – he would be sailing away in the polls. My only hope is that the economy nose dives and the house prices start to decline then Cameron might have a chance. In other words: when people start to hurt, they look for someone to blame. People are still frankly quite comfortable.

A party that doesn’t have big business and Murdoch in its pocket is a party that simply will not win the next general election. Bliar’s Iraq was enough to lose votes close enough for the Tories to be in chance of a win for a future GE, but that has gone and brown is undergoing a huge media image transformation (including voice coaching).

Interesting times…hopefully now the lines can be drawn in the sand and Cameron can start creating policies without brown copying them.

[Bagpuss]

The problem is when the soundbite accusation of Cameron not standing for anything is used.. Howard et al are snookered because they can't say, well actually he would do this or that. The best they can say is he stands for community spirit, self reliance, and green issues, or some such meaningless bollocks. The issues which would attract voters are largely disguarded in a misguided attempt to be more holier (or PC) than thou or mimic the policies of the other parties.

[Old Greg]

So what will be everyone's plan B?

Government minister by the look of things.

[Jog On]

So what will be everyone's plan B?

[hyperD]

"Don't be so sure, Labour are ahead in the polls:"

Every new leader gets a bump in their poll rating. Hopefully this dour fecker will get a fecking big bump where it hurts. Did anybody see question time last night. That Pires Morgan bloke needs a swift kick in the nuts also.

Yeah, I saw QT last night. To be honest I get a bit fed up with it to be honest with the bias towards Tory bashing. Dimbers is quite happy to stir up Tory bashing but then tones it down and moves on whenever anything gets to heated on liebour.

Also, Piers Moron was his usual tabloid sensationalist self: berating Howard constantly and singing brown's praises. To be honest, Howard was pretty ineffectual and looked like he was setup to be the fall guy.

Yvette Cooper was just another patronising bint from liebour - I just hate the way these types look to the audience, adopt this whining, patronising "oh you poor thick audience, let me gently explain in simple terms" nasal tone and then outpour this cacaphony of soundbites and then attempt to look smug after they've lied.

The backtracking she did when challenged on the obvious "let the developers build on the flood plain as long as we keep the money flowing" duplicity after her fake concern on environmental planning issues in her vacuous little ditty before just summed up their behaviour as "we say and do anything just to stay in power".

Moron seemed content to just be obnoxious to anything that Howard said reflecting the popular pastime of being nasty to the old Tories.

Interestingly in the cabinet we have:-

An agriculture minister who is a vegetarian.
Two brothers.
A man and his wife.
A leader of the House who is Chairman of the Labour Party.
48% less women than under bliar.
Educational backgrounds mainly politics and economics.
No real world business experience.
Bulk of them sacked or resigned under Blair.
Digby Jones was a lawyer with no business experience.
A postman in charge of the NHS-the NHS will be in its element with the postmen on strike!

[BoredBloke]

Agreed, but he has been moaning on about New Labour and Blair for years. The minute Brown steps in and he reverts back to type. Everything Howard said he shouted over and quoted things which were not true and simply carried on speaking louder so that he couldn't be heard.

Labour will be no different under Brown. He has been part and parcel of this government since 97.