Reply to: Indian doctors.

[Euro-commuter]

I thought the French paid a lot more than us, but according to those figures they don't !

If you want it in terms of how it would affect you personally, let me just point out that the compulsory health insurance in France is essentially a percentage of your income, or in the case of a contractor, your turnover. I.e. it bites like a tax rather than like insurance: you pay more the higher your income, not the higher your risk.

[rootsnall]

Out of curiosity how many of you have private Medical now?

Not me, possibly flawed theory is I'll pay cash if needed.

[Barriebazg]

Out of curiosity how many of you have private Medical now?

Me

[rootsnall]

Exactly, other countries have a looser arrangement with a mix of direct and indirect funding.

I know it always puts a dampener on things, but here are the last available stats for OECD country expenditure. I'm not sure how it will look now more money has been poured in in the last two years.

I thought the French paid a lot more than us, but according to those figures they don't ! I think the US system is the one to be avoided. All the countries are facing the same problems as us, more oldies, more treatments available, a lot more dosh needed. What I don't fancy is being an oldie in a non NHS UK.

[Swiss Tony]

Out of curiosity how many of you have private Medical now?

[Rantor]

The UK is the ONLY country in Europe where the system is centrally funded by govt. Even in France, which we consider Socialist, there is a large private element (and i don't mean BUPA, separate from the state). Private companies have to contribute towards the national pot. Eminently sensible.
The NHS needs root and branch reform, but no party dares touch this political hot potato. Meanwhile we will keep chucking money into a black hole.

Exactly, other countries have a looser arrangement with a mix of direct and indirect funding.

I know it always puts a dampener on things, but here are the last available stats for OECD country expenditure. I'm not sure how it will look now more money has been poured in in the last two years.

[sasguru]

The UK is the ONLY country in Europe where the system is centrally funded by govt. Even in France, which we consider Socialist, there is a large private element (and i don't mean BUPA, separate from the state). Private companies have to contribute towards the national pot. Eminently sensible.
The NHS needs root and branch reform, but no party dares touch this political hot potato. Meanwhile we will keep chucking money into a black hole.

[Barriebazg]

Barriebazg - I'm not saying I wouldn't change my mind if I had a bad experience !

All my experiences have been pretty good so far. It's impossible for the NHS to provide unlimited services and you may have to fend for yourself at times which I realise isn't ideal. But the alternatives cost a lot more, I think the US and French systems cost twice as much per head. If you are going to get sick then France isn't a bad option, I ended up in hospital there while playing rugby and it was more like a 5* hotel, it cost those french tax payers a fortune though.

Oh yes I fully understand. I am of course with Bupa now. I did however visit a sick friend in an NHS hospital and they had been dealt with very efficiently and was not treated anywhere as bad as I was. I was just in the wrong place/hospital at the wrong time.

[rootsnall]

Barriebazg - I'm not saying I wouldn't change my mind if I had a bad experience !

All my experiences have been pretty good so far. It's impossible for the NHS to provide unlimited services and you may have to fend for yourself at times which I realise isn't ideal. But the alternatives cost a lot more, I think the US and French systems cost twice as much per head. If you are going to get sick then France isn't a bad option, I ended up in hospital there while playing rugby and it was more like a 5* hotel, it cost those french tax payers a fortune though.

[sunnysan]

NHS vs India

If I am not mistaken the hospital in India is private and of course the NHS is state.

You cannot really compare the two entities if my assumptions are correct.

I would imagine for impoverished Indians, healthcare is as bad if not worse than the NHS

I am not justifying the chaos which is the NHS at the moment. I have had bad experiences and I basically will not go and see a GP for any chronic ailment as they are, either cr$p or working to hard, or trying as much as possible to fob you off as to save money or the fact that they have to do loads of paperwork if they refer you etc.

The fact of the matter is, that , for "free" state healthcare, the NHS is better than equivalent state health care in many countries.

What I do agree with, is that is should be a lot better, since its probably the most heavily funded system in Western Europe and posssibly the worst in Western Europe as well.

You will recieve better private medical care in places like SA,Brazil, Thailand , India etc but I think if you compare quality of state medical care you will see a more accurate picture

[_V_]

It's called the NHS postcode lottery.

You lose.

[Barriebazg]

I have just spent a fair bit of time in an NHS hospital visiting a sick relative and I found it to be well staffed, very clean and all in all I would think pretty good value compared to us all having private insurance. It was in a lot better state than 10 years ago when I last spent time there and the toerags were running the NHS into the ground. Tony & Co have cocked most things up but keeping the NHS up and running wasn't one of them.

I can't agree with you there. about 12 weeks ago I was in an NHS hopsital with severe kidney pains (turns out I had kidney failure). Anyways the first time I was in I was in A&E for 16hrs, 12 of those on a trolley in the corridor, 3 of them kicked off the bed and had to sit on a crappy plastic chair in the corridor and the last hr back on the bed, to be told that since I had no pain anymore (I was doped up on morphine) that I was being discharged. 2 days later back in as I was just in constant pain. I then spent a further 18hrs in A&E, all the time with no fluid, thus accelarating the kidney failure progress. Finally admitted to a ward and moved to 3 different wards due to bed shortages. It turns out, that the first time I was in, if I was probably looked after it could have been knocked on the head if they had the proper facilities (drinking water widely available, bed on a ward so I was looked after and monitored properly). Over the last 3-4yrs this has been a huge problem within the NHS and addressed numerous times and still nothing sorted.


So I dont agree with you at all sorry.

[_V_]

I too am visiting a sick relative and hospital is less than 5 years old, clean, staff are good and the care is (generally) very good.

This was one of those PFI deals. However the staff told me the cost was astronomical, hence not enough staff and whole wards empty whilst others are turning away patients to keep costs down. The NHS Trust are paying millions for the hospital with no way out of the spiralling costs. A complete money pit. Equipment not used as too expensive to run and staff.

[rootsnall]

I have just spent a fair bit of time in an NHS hospital visiting a sick relative and I found it to be well staffed, very clean and all in all I would think pretty good value compared to us all having private insurance. It was in a lot better state than 10 years ago when I last spent time there and the toerags were running the NHS into the ground. Tony & Co have cocked most things up but keeping the NHS up and running wasn't one of them.

[Buffoon]

I think most countries have political untouchables and ours is the NHS with all political parties just offering tinkering at the edges.

The yanks have a phrase for it : "the third rail".