Reply to: Working for free...

[DodgyAgent]

I would normally have said 'it takes one to know one.'

now you are being a smart arse

[Denny]

You are not such a kno* after all

I would normally have said 'it takes one to know one.'

[PerlOfWisdom]

I'd work for free

free quid a minute

[DodgyAgent]

I've just finished my contract which earned me far more than I originally thought it would. He was a good client and I liked and respected him. For that reason I said to my client that he could call if he'd forgotten to ask me anything following our close out meeting on Friday. We had a long discussion about what forward planning he needed to think about next year regarding my field. You could argue that this is stupid. I am giving them direction they could pass onto the permie to benefit from without me biling there to carry out the work myself.

However, I feel this is a short-term and unproductive attitude. My client told me there was definitely a possibility of me coming back to the programme if I was needed and I know for a fact that he hasnt' replaced me with someone else on daily fees. The work is now being picked up internally. Fair enough. That's business. I may not come back, but I have much better chance if I leave the client with good memories of my attitude.

However, if I had told my client to shove any further enquiries or hadn't cooperated with any forward planning advice, then my chances of coming back would be much reduced.

You'll find that all businesses have to give some freebie advice. Solicitors, plumbers etc. It's called oiling the wheels for future business. These are certainly the ones I would call again for further work or at least refer to others if I didn't need them myself, not the ones who refused to give an inch without billing first.

You are not such a kno* after all

[Denny]

Erm, at the risk of sounding like a management consultant ('cos that's what I am), have you thought of offering support contracts at the end of your time there? Something along the lines of
"I know that you don't need a full time body any more, but you may need some ad-hoc support to answer any questions or queries that come up when my replacement is getting up to speed. I can't guarantee my availability (because I may be fully committed on another assignment). But I can offer phone and email support for a period of [3] months after the end of the contract, for a fixed fee of [whatever 3 days fees would have been."

I have done v. similar things with change management/coaching projects and found that the client was really grateful to have guaranteed support (even though he didn't actually use it)

Not sure I agree with your terms. If I was billing for after support I would certainly expect them to be available no matter how little I intended to use them. To say to your client that you will offer after-support for a billed service and then say you may not be available doesn't seem to be like a very business like attitude.

Either do it free of charge on a may or may not be available basis, or bill on a definitely available basis, even it's only a few minutes at a time.

You can't have it both ways and remain credible. I'm not surprised they haven't taken you up on it.

[DS23]

Never, ever, do freebies.

Disagree. Sometimes it is beneficial to do freebies. I gave away a day's consultancy last March and was offered a 3 month contract at my asking rate the following day. Agree that after-contract freebies should be controlled though and the kind of control depends on the kind of client.

[premiere]

Providing 'free support services' after you have left a contract.....depends on how often the ex-client calls and the work involved.

Years ago I worked for an IT Solutions co (as a contractor), but left after 6 months. Then went to HP working in Liverpool on a contract basis for 2 months (fixed term project).

Whilst ex-client had severe probs and didn't have in-house skills, they caled upon my services by e-mail and phone 3 times in 2 weeks. I didn't charge them as they were easy things to fix (by advice over the phone), but they were eternally grateful.

They rewarded me with an offer of new 6 month rolling deal, which I happily accepted (as I hated Liverpool...being away from home and all that)

The 6 month rolling deal then lasted 4 years and took me through the severe downturn that the industry experienced.

[Epiphone]

Point them to your T's & C's that contain something like

Only the good or services discussed and agreed upon in initial contact or estimate will be carried out and billed for. Any and all other additional services will be charged accordingly. Telephone/e-mail support shall be charged at 15 minute intervals and an invoice submitted when outstanding charges equal one (1) hour or 30 days have elapsed.

Works for me with the consumer customers.

[stackpole]

Agreed Denny - its investing in relationships (ie keeping in touch with a potential source of income)

Agreed XLMonkey - but not for a ten-minute phone call every now and again. Not in my line of work anyway.

[XLMonkey]

Erm, at the risk of sounding like a management consultant ('cos that's what I am), have you thought of offering support contracts at the end of your time there? Something along the lines of
"I know that you don't need a full time body any more, but you may need some ad-hoc support to answer any questions or queries that come up when my replacement is getting up to speed. I can't guarantee my availability (because I may be fully committed on another assignment). But I can offer phone and email support for a period of [3] months after the end of the contract, for a fixed fee of [whatever 3 days fees would have been."

I have done v. similar things with change management/coaching projects and found that the client was really grateful to have guaranteed support (even though he didn't actually use it)

[Denny]

I've just finished my contract which earned me far more than I originally thought it would. He was a good client and I liked and respected him. For that reason I said to my client that he could call if he'd forgotten to ask me anything following our close out meeting on Friday. We had a long discussion about what forward planning he needed to think about next year regarding my field. You could argue that this is stupid. I am giving them direction they could pass onto the permie to benefit from without me biling there to carry out the work myself.

However, I feel this is a short-term and unproductive attitude. My client told me there was definitely a possibility of me coming back to the programme if I was needed and I know for a fact that he hasnt' replaced me with someone else on daily fees. The work is now being picked up internally. Fair enough. That's business. I may not come back, but I have much better chance if I leave the client with good memories of my attitude.

However, if I had told my client to shove any further enquiries or hadn't cooperated with any forward planning advice, then my chances of coming back would be much reduced.

You'll find that all businesses have to give some freebie advice. Solicitors, plumbers etc. It's called oiling the wheels for future business. These are certainly the ones I would call again for further work or at least refer to others if I didn't need them myself, not the ones who refused to give an inch without billing first.

[donaldduke]

Ok, this is starting to annoy me now.

I do not work for free!

That is the third time today that I have had someone from the last contract I did phone up and ask me a question. I starting to think that they are getting an extra invoice.

At the moment I am being all nice and kind becase

*one moment phone rings* yeah....ha ha...yeah....got that. *phone goes down*

Anway. As I was saying I'm all up for helping people out but FFS phoneing me up and asking me to work through a method counts as work. If you had questions you should have asked them last week when I was still there.

Not going to tell them to jiff off just yet as I was hoping that there is a contract extension somewhere to be had...

Depends on the client, if they were good and treated me with respect then i dont mind being helpful and answering a few questions after leaving, chances are they would have paid a small fortune while i was there, and you can believe that no client ever gets me to work for the money they pay (i always do enough to get renewed but no more, unless they pay me overtime).

If they treat me like sh1t (very rare) but sometimes the orginal boss (who did the interview) is replaced by an assh0le, in which case i would say say call me back later and then turn the my phone off. They will soon get the message.

However chances are they will ask a co-worker who got on well with you tocall, then it would be harder to say no.

[threaded]

You've already done it for free, so the chances of an extension are vanishingly small.

Never, ever, do freebies.


Youngsters, you have to tell them to clean behind the ears fer cryin out loud.

[zathras]

Now they've just asked me to knock up another sheet. Only 5 mins work but FFS!

Whats the nicest way to tell a Director level person to go **** themselves.

Answer:

If you can let me know exactly what you need I will be happy to return a quote by return of post.

[Cowboy Bob]

Now they've just asked me to knock up another sheet. Only 5 mins work but FFS!

Whats the nicest way to tell a Director level person to go **** themselves.

How about - "Go **** yourself?"

You'll lose out on any extension (though if they thought you'd be coming back they wouldn't be asking these questions, they'd be offering the extension to you). But damn will it feel good