Reply to: Alex Salmond calls for English referendum

[darmstadt]

A referendum is a once a generation type question, a re-run should only happen in the event of electoral fraud or error, suggesting a new one when there was a clear majority is sour grapes and shows a lack of understanding as to what democracy is supposed to represent.

Tell that to the Swiss. There's been 12 referendums this year and one of them twice: Immigration

[TestMangler]

There's a significant difference between a referendum and a General Election they're not close to comparable, even the Scots posters on here know that although they chose to behave otherwise.

A referendum is a once a generation type question, a re-run should only happen in the event of electoral fraud or error, suggesting a new one when there was a clear majority is sour grapes and shows a lack of understanding as to what democracy is supposed to represent.

Just in case you weren't sure, this is from the Oxford English...

A general vote by the electorate on a single political question which has been referred to them for a direct decision.

Not seeing any details in there about time barring or generations.

If a country votes in a government who's manifesto contains a pledge to hold a referendum on anything, regardless of whether or not you agree with it, then that referendum should take place. Maybe instead of moaning about everything, you should start/join a party that holds similar beliefs to you and hope they get elected. Once that happens you can hold a referendum about never having another referendum.

[Batcher]

Revealed: The SNP’s terms for supporting a minority Miliband government « Labour Uncut

Indyref part 2 on it's way

[Batcher]

So you agree that Thatcher is dead? How can you be a quisling if you are supporting the overall interests of one country, the UK? The Red Torys are supporting their interests - Keeping the gravy train going. I'm amused you think Salmond is any different.

The UK isn't a country.

HTHBIDI

[TykeMerc]

So are you saying we shouldn't have a general election in 2015 ? That question was settled in 2010

There's a significant difference between a referendum and a General Election they're not close to comparable, even the Scots posters on here know that although they chose to behave otherwise.

A referendum is a once a generation type question, a re-run should only happen in the event of electoral fraud or error, suggesting a new one when there was a clear majority is sour grapes and shows a lack of understanding as to what democracy is supposed to represent.

[Batcher]

Yes, and they would all be in the tulipter right now, with oil at $50 a barrell Scotland is set to become an economic wasteland. There is no way the SNP are going to go for independence now. They didn't have much of an economic case before, now it's completely screwed.

They plan on pushing through total French style socialism through the back door, I don't think it's going to fly south of the border. Before you start dancing around, be aware that if there is no overall winner in the election the party with the most MP's get's to play first, that doesn't look like Labour, if it is the Conservatives and the SNP holds the balance, we will just have another election. My guess is that UKIP and the Conservatives will do a deal just before the election for a referendum on the EU.

As for Alex Salmond, loses the referendum, resigns from the party, now running as Westminster MP. The expression "weasel" springs to mind.

Once again for the hard of thinking (FTAOD that means you), oil was always going to be a bonus. The economics weren't based purely on the price of oil.

Alex Salmond has always fought for what is best for Scotland, unlike the Quislings of the red tories who say one thing to Scots and do another to appease the south east. They are the true weasels.

[zemoxyl]

My guess is that UKIP and the Conservatives will do a deal just before the election for a referendum on the EU.

They can do a deal all they like : have nerverendums ad nauseum. But unless UKIP win outright, no one is going anywhere.

the Daily Telegraph reported on Thursday that French President Francois Hollande planned to veto Mr Cameron’s request for EU treaty changes to include a new settlement for Britain on Europe

And on the point of the oil price, yes you're quite right about the ramifications there. Britain's current account deficit is now at its all time high of £27 billion.

UK's quarterly current account deficit now bigger as a % of GDP than it was in the Lawson boom of the late 1980s:

Source Macrobond.

[TestMangler]

Yes, we are all saying it.

Are so seriously brain damaged that you think even if you got independence for Scotland that it would be viable country? Have you been following economic events? i.e. the price of Oil?

I've read my post that you quoted and I still can't see the bit where I mentioned an of that.

Brillo was suggesting that once an issue is voted on, that is the end of it. I was suggesting that is not the case. Nothing more, nothing less.

[TestMangler]

Yes, and they would all be in the tulipter right now, with oil at $50 a barrell Scotland is set to become an economic wasteland. There is no way the SNP are going to go for independence now. They didn't have much of an economic case before, now it's completely screwed.

They plan on pushing through total French style socialism through the back door, I don't think it's going to fly south of the border. Before you start dancing around, be aware that if there is no overall winner in the election the party with the most MP's get's to play first, that doesn't look like Labour, if it is the Conservatives and the SNP holds the balance, we will just have another election. My guess is that UKIP and the Conservatives will do a deal just before the election for a referendum on the EU.

As for Alex Salmond, loses the referendum, resigns from the party, now running as Westminster MP. The expression "weasel" springs to mind.

When did that happen ?

[TestMangler]

Are there really no grown ups in Scotland who can think for themselves?

I don't understand why this thread about England has been hijacked by the Scotland debate which should have been dead and buried last September?

So are you saying we shouldn't have a general election in 2015 ? That question was settled in 2010

[BrilloPad]

England must be resolute and save the Scots from self-destruction - Telegraph

The English need to save the Scots from self destruction. Nice.

Are there really no grown ups in Scotland who can think for themselves?

I don't understand why this thread about England has been hijacked by the Scotland debate which should have been dead and buried last September?

[Batcher]

England must be resolute and save the Scots from self-destruction - Telegraph

The English need to save the Scots from self destruction. Nice.

There's a few stories in the Torygraph along those lines. Seems they are doing their best to stir up things for another referendum. He didn't mention that the reason a lot of people in central Scotland/Lanarkshire are on the dole is due to Thatcher closing down manufacturing, steelworks and coal mines in that area.

[mudskipper]

England must be resolute and save the Scots from self-destruction - Telegraph

The English need to save the Scots from self destruction. Nice.

[TestMangler]

Lets just hope that this doesn't mutate into Labour working with the SNP to get a coalition or something like it... although I think that would aggravate the English electorate, were it to transpire, by making obvious what has been the case for years. That said, even if it were to happen, if the Tories entered a confidence and supply arrangement with UKIP they'd still race ahead.

I don't think the SNP would ever enter a coalition with labour. They may cooperate on certain things, but not a coalition. The SNP have always had a policy of not voting on English only matters.

Whatever happens and whatever anyone's views or beliefs, the 2015 GE should be more interesting than any election for a while, with the emergence of support for UKIP and the SNP. The 'main' parties will have to do more then try and sound the most trustworthy with what are essentially the same (focus group and headline tested) policies.

[Zero Liability]

Latest poll:

Labour set for a bloodbath in Scotland in general election, poll says | UK news | The Guardian

Lets just hope that this doesn't mutate into Labour working with the SNP to get a coalition or something like it... although I think that would aggravate the English electorate, were it to transpire, by making obvious what has been the case for years. That said, even if it were to happen, if the Tories entered a confidence and supply arrangement with UKIP they'd still race ahead.