Reply to: Agency covering their back not to pay for services provided - is this legal?

[Goldengirl]

Thanks guys Don´t know how they will react, yet, but we´ll see..
Will keep you posted (if interested)..

Good one about the LaFosse - we are warned now

[speling bee]

I like the cut of La Fosse's jib.

The great news is that they describe how they are different: How we are Different | La Fosse Associates

Disappointingly, their website doe not obviously give their company number, VAT number and other pieces of information required by the Companies Act.

[speling bee]

La fosse is French for pit.

Le fossé is French for ditch.

La fosse septique is French for septic tank.

Curse my Latin education.

[TheFaQQer]

A fosse is a ditch really, like Fosse Way.

I would fosse them if I were you.

La fosse is French for pit.

Le fossé is French for ditch.

La fosse septique is French for septic tank.

[speling bee]

There's an agency that chose the name "The Pit"?

A fosse is a ditch really, like Fosse Way.

I would fosse them if I were you.

[TheFaQQer]

LaFosse try this too with varying limits on dates. I made them delete the lot

There's an agency that chose the name "The Pit"?

[Batcher]

No you wouldn't.

Once an agency knows that you can be bothered to pay a solicitor to review your contract and redraft clauses, they realise that you will be trouble if they don't pay you......

Possibly, but in my case I would give them a body swerve.

[SueEllen]

Well done for getting good advice.

I must admit if I had to go to this trouble before starting a contract I wouldn't want to do business with them. It would always be in the back of my mind that I would need to take them to court to get paid further down the line.

No you wouldn't.

Once an agency knows that you can be bothered to pay a solicitor to review your contract and redraft clauses, they realise that you will be trouble if they don't pay you......

[Batcher]

Well done for getting good advice.

I must admit if I had to go to this trouble before starting a contract I wouldn't want to do business with them. It would always be in the back of my mind that I would need to take them to court to get paid further down the line.

[tractor]

...

UPDATE: I just got in parallel an answer from a solicitor on this - might be helpful for others, if they run into similar situations:
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Solicitor´s answer:


Q: 1)Is it legal/enforceable that they put such a short time limit onto submitting timesheets/expenses = invoices, and claim they won´t pay me in that case? (legal limit is 6 yrs, I believe?)
A: they can put what time limit they like on the court would not enforce it.

Q: 2) Is it legal/enforceable that they put such a short time limit onto notifying them that they have missed a payment, and claim they won´t pay me in that case?
A: Ditto

Q: 3) Is it legal/enforceable that they weasel their way out of late payment charges with a process that THEY put in place, instead of the one who´s owed money to (=me)?
A: with regard to late payment charges, simply add them on under the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (interest) act and the Late Payment of commercial Debts Regulations if it is late and let the court to decide the issue. You can add late payment charges on under the regulations provided there is no other provision in the contract for late payment charges. There is also no provision for the charges to be waived while there is a dispute.

If this is a new contract to replace an old one, you can tell them that this this and this not acceptable and they should delete the various clauses.

It is then up to you whether you carry on doing business with them and up to them whether they carry on doing business with you.
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Well done for standing your ground and doing it properly

LaFosse try this too with varying limits on dates. I made them delete the lot

[Goldengirl]

UPDATE: I just got in parallel an answer from a solicitor on this - might be helpful for others, if they run into similar situations:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Solicitor´s answer:


Q: 1)Is it legal/enforceable that they put such a short time limit onto submitting timesheets/expenses = invoices, and claim they won´t pay me in that case? (legal limit is 6 yrs, I believe?)
A: they can put what time limit they like on the court would not enforce it.

Q: 2) Is it legal/enforceable that they put such a short time limit onto notifying them that they have missed a payment, and claim they won´t pay me in that case?
A: Ditto

Q: 3) Is it legal/enforceable that they weasel their way out of late payment charges with a process that THEY put in place, instead of the one who´s owed money to (=me)?
A: with regard to late payment charges, simply add them on under the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (interest) act and the Late Payment of commercial Debts Regulations if it is late and let the court to decide the issue. You can add late payment charges on under the regulations provided there is no other provision in the contract for late payment charges. There is also no provision for the charges to be waived while there is a dispute.

If this is a new contract to replace an old one, you can tell them that this this and this not acceptable and they should delete the various clauses.

It is then up to you whether you carry on doing business with them and up to them whether they carry on doing business with you.
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[Goldengirl]

Many thanks for the responses so far - oops, seems like I´ve forgotten to edit one instance out

@gillsMan: Yes, exactly!
Generally, I don´t think they´d actively try to not pay as such, however eg. the systems for submitting timesheets (or rather codes to put times against) are often not working/disactivated, and sometimes it takes weeks and months (!), until they are reactivated. And if not put against the proper project code, the timesheet is not approved = not paid.... that easily can be over 45 days since having worked.

Also, we "small people" need to pay late fees for even 1 day late for all kinds of services, utilities etc, but they say "hey, WE don´t consider the invoice we have allegedly not paid "overdue", until WE say it is - and by that time we probably have already paid it. Either way, we´re never paying late fees"..

Plus "and even IF YOU think it´s late/missed payment, you only submitted your timesheet on day 46 after you´ve worked, not on day 45 days - so actually, we don´t owe you anything at all. look into your contract"
or "even IF YOU think it´s a late/missed payment, you only notified us on day 31 after due date, you missed the deadline - too bad for you - thanks for working for us for free!"

Has anyone ever seen anything like this before? because I haven´t...

[GillsMan]

IANAL but I struggle to believe that they could delay payment by 30 days and, if you do not notice, that payment is no longer due. That definitely seems legally suspect to me.

[TheFaQQer]

If you didn't opt out, in writing, before being introduced to the client, then it's all rubbish anyway because they have to pay you for the work that you did.

[kevpuk]

Hhhhmmm - is XXX Experis?

Anyway, it seems to me like these excerpts are simply documenting a process to follow should issues arise.
If anything, it could be argued to be a good thing that there is a process.

Signed timesheets are required to get paid, and they need to be submitted in a timely fashion - seems OK to me?
If you don't actually get the money, having followed the above, then a process exists to remedy.