Reply to: Certification, can you get by without it when you have experience?

[mcquiggd]

The logo was hastily removed when my boss proudly announced that he'd tear up any CV bedecked with such tosh. No one has ever asked me to verify my qualification.

So you had a boss who can't pass certifications

Certs get you past HR, experience gets you the job.

[oxtailsoup]

I am SAP certified. I have no idea if it has enabled me to get interviews but it has certainly never been mentioned at or after an interview. Never in 6 years.

Experience is everything. Certification is a nice to have.

[MildredSnatch]

Certification can work for employers' exams.

I don't want to blow my own trumpet - well, truth be told, I do want to blow my own trumpet - but I passed the MCSD exams in five weeks. In mitigation I did have several years experience and used practice exams as revision. Afterwards I passed through a brief period of idiocy - putting the logo on my CV and suchlike. The logo was hastily removed when my boss proudly announced that he'd tear up any CV bedecked with such tosh. No one has ever asked me to verify my qualification.

Having the qualifications on your CV can bedazzle the inexperienced recruitment consultant. If it's a choice between you and the next contractor with similar experience it'd probably swing it.

What the exams actually teach you is how to pass exams; pass a few certification exams and you can sail through any exam that a prospective employer might set you and that allows you to concentrate on not screwing up at the interview.

In my opinion the Microsoft exams are a bit Mickey Mouse-ish; the Sun exams a little bit trickier - has anyone actually sat the SCJD exam?

[expat]

One of my favourite phrases when someone tells me they have 10 years experience is to say "Yes that's all very well but is it the same 6 month's experience 20 times over....."

Lockhouse (who is certified and experienced).

I've been asked that question. The answer I give is, "No, it isn't".

[Beermachine]

For the majority of companies certification makes no difference what-so-ever, nice to have's but its the commercial experience that makes the difference. Most companies concerned about the knowledge of the developers they hire tend to have their own technical tests rather than rely on official ones.

As has been mentioned, there are a few notiably large exceptions, where it is most certainly needed to get past the keepers of the CV. This is usually the case when the oh so efficient HR dept is managing the recruitment process on the hiring managers behalf, and given their vast technical expertise will happily throw out a CV of the best ever IT Consultant in the world on the basis that they don't have that nice logo in the corner!

There are a few exceptions, ITIL and Prince 2 Certification are starting to become more and more needed for Managers on up, mainly because more managers are taking them and the ones who dont are starting to stand out for that very fact.

[mcquiggd]

Certification can sometimes be based on learning the 'Company X' way of doing things... for example, a lot of the questions on the older Microsoft MCSD exams could be guessed by picking the one that meant you had to invest in more MS licences. I doubt Oracle et al are any different.

However, some are reasonably difficult, and do require some knowledge.

Personally, I think the Brainbench questions are actually tougher than the MS certifications ones. On a couple of occasions I have had companies ask me to take online tests where you have 30 minutes to answer 40 or so questions. They are a lot more in depth, possibly to offset the possibility of Googling for an answer!

(P.S I am an MCSD.Net and Brainbench Master - C# .. cough!)

[snaw]

Personally excepting a few biggies I think it makes no difference, but in many companies it's the key in the door - if some manager if flicking through a bunch of CV's it's quite easy to do the first cut based purely on who's got the certs they're after.

[Diestl]

It might swing it if all else is equal between candidates however experience is the key I think 3 years is a kind of minimum?

[Lockhouse]

One of my favourite phrases when someone tells me they have 10 years experience is to say "Yes that's all very well but is it the same 6 month's experience 20 times over....."

Lockhouse (who is certified and experienced).

[BOBJ]

For the sort of jobs I apply for I have never, ever seen certification mentioned, even as a nice to have. As an interviewer I might ask a question about it if someone says they're certified but that'd be about it.

[swamp]

All certification does is make it easier to get iinterviews. You can't get out your certificate in the middle of a technical test and say "look what I got!". It means nothing without experience.

On the other hand, experience sometimes means nothing in a technical test.

[kramer]

it does show interest and helps bolster you r claims of knowing this thing or that.. having said that i have been on the MCSD track for 10 years and still only sat one exam...

[ratewhore]

All certification does is make it easier to get iinterviews. You can't get out your certificate in the middle of a technical test and say "look what I got!". It means nothing without experience.

Although there are those that do exactly that. Speaking of which - I still have my O level certificates somewhere. I'll have to dig them out for the next interview...

[Lockhouse]

All certification does is make it easier to get iinterviews. You can't get out your certificate in the middle of a technical test and say "look what I got!". It means nothing without experience.

[DimPrawn]

Or is it a necessary evil?

Being certified in any particular field will do no harm. By the same token it might make no difference whatsoever.

This means if you have nothing better to do and you can do it at low cost, it is definately worthwhile, otherwise, don't bother.

I'm talking about Microsoft Certs specifically. Others may be a different story.

The MS certs have been massively devalued by India giving them away for a couple of quid due to their built in ability to do corruption and lies at very low cost.