Reply to: PM Contract Market Is...

[norrahe]

I'm on LinkedIn and have many agents as connections, it's really useful as a lot of them post new roles coming in on their status' and it feels more 'real-time' than searching JobServe every evening. Also, more companies are advertising roles direct on LinkedIn, I've been contacted directly several times by companies looking to hire and actively searching for candidates this way. I've got three interviews lined up over the next week, two from LinkedIn and one from JobServe, sign of the times?

Definitely, I've also been contacted directly by a company to consult with them as a result of posts on groups.

[DanielAnthony]

I'm on LinkedIn and have many agents as connections, it's really useful as a lot of them post new roles coming in on their status' and it feels more 'real-time' than searching JobServe every evening. Also, more companies are advertising roles direct on LinkedIn, I've been contacted directly several times by companies looking to hire and actively searching for candidates this way. I've got three interviews lined up over the next week, two from LinkedIn and one from JobServe, sign of the times?

[The Agents View]

SME is a subject matter expert, not a rookie. It would have taken the initiative of 1 google search to understand that, before spouting your "you dont have the skills" rhetoric. The problem is right there, in that non techhy agents pushing contracts like car sales do no one any favours other than themselves.

Err..I'm a non techy agent, and I don't work Techy contracts. Your point is what here?? The way I read that, is that you are a "Subject Matter Expert" who wants to do a contract in something he's not an expert in. That's not likely to be the best sales pitch to be fair. If I've read it wrong, it's because I don't understand the jargon, because I have no need to do so.....

No "bee in my bonnet" companies like Google, Microsoft and Adobe have a very very limited few agents who can speak with them, via intermediary departments. Outside agents CANNOT find these contacts by other means, its very very controlled.

I know how to get to at least 2 people directly in charge of hiring for 2 of those companies - now granted, that's because they are local-ish to me, and they happen to be friends, or friends of friends - but it's pretty easy to find a route to hire if you need to. Microsoft etc, did not climb to the heights, without working with people who have something that they want to find a route to supply.

The problem is as illustrated, Agents often have absolutely no understanding of the technical aspects of the role they are trying to fill, or the clients skillsets. As times get harder the margins seem to be getting higher , not lower. What value does your average agent add (I know 2 decent agents in 8 years of the game)

I AM NOT A TECHNICAL AGENT. I AM NOT AN IT RECRUITER. How many flaming times?

In my personal area of expertise, my knowledge is deep, and first hand. I spend alot of time on site, not just selling, but sitting with teams to understand what they do, understanding their culture, understand what they do and don't like. However, what I do, is NOT IT RECRUITMENT. Your above statement is akin to me stating that you're a rubbish MS SME because you don't understand railway engineering........

I wish you the best, but for me its hot air , I've never done business over IRC or MSN chat or whatever buzzy social networking thing and doubt my clients will be doing it in a hurry either.

Two people being interviewed by Skype this week - both with companies many would consider to be archaic - Nobody will be adopting this technology any time soon.....

The only thing i've heard about social networking is that i might help cut out the middle man.. Eg the agent.

Unlikely - recruiting is an art as much as the technicalities of running projects. Trust me when I tell you, that you'd be bored of it, within minutes.

I do however, hope that companies do try and cut out the agencies - you really don't know what you've got, 'til it's gone.

[The Agents View]

I would be happy to use a phone or laptop that was more than 6 years old, as long as it met my minimum requirements (old phone to make phone calls, old laptop to surf the interweb and check emails).

Well then your competitors, are going to be one step ahead of you. You should probably factor that into your future business plan.

To date, none of my clients who have interviewed me have checked my LinkedIn profile or asked me to explain any descrepancy between my LinkedIn profile and my CV.

I would bet that someone, somewhere along the line, has checked your details out - the fact that they've missed the discrepancies, is probably not down to that person not noticing, but more down to them not communicating it.

I don't ask people to give me references on LinkedIn as it is very biased towards positive feedback and the system used to provide references on LinkedIn is flawed in that I can create fake contacts and provide fake references in order to give a false impression of my abilities. Are you seriously telling me that you would gladly accept a LinkedIn reference over any other type of reference? If agencies want references, they can speak to other agencies to confirm I have worked for the said client and ask them for feedback. If they don't like it, I'll look for another contract.

If I want references I'll call your previous employer - with or without a contact to speak to - I won't be speaking to your previous agent - they're not important to me.

You may wish to discredit me on my point above for now, but in time people will take LinkedIn references as unreliable.

At the end of the day, it's about building a case. Add your LinkedIn references to references I've taken, and you could suggest that the case is pretty strong to interview you.

For as long as Jobserve, Jobsite, Planetrecruit and other job boards are still around, I will continue to use these boards to find jobs.

And sadly, so will thousands of other candidates who are unable to adapt to the times. Those will be your competition. Get ahead of the game. Use the different tools available to you, and as new tools become available, adopt them! They might just give you a flow of contracts for a couple of years!

If you want to use LinkedIn, go for it. If you find me via LinkedIn, I would gladly speak to you, as long as you take my CV as gospel over my LinkedIn profile.

I wouldn't do it any other way - what I'm saying, is that in order to get your CV involved in the process, then there are a variety of ways of doing that - Job sites are, for me, at the bottom of the pile, which means you would only get a look in, if the newer, more modern processes have failed.

[Scoobos]

SME is a subject matter expert, not a rookie. It would have taken the initiative of 1 google search to understand that, before spouting your "you dont have the skills" rhetoric. The problem is right there, in that non techhy agents pushing contracts like car sales do no one any favours other than themselves.

No "bee in my bonnet" companies like Google, Microsoft and Adobe have a very very limited few agents who can speak with them, via intermediary departments. Outside agents CANNOT find these contacts by other means, its very very controlled.

To answer your question I met my contact by becoming known to them via my work, and m contribution to the growth of a brand new product, not by some 20 year old college dropout calling them mate and sending "prespective syopsis" emails around (my experince of agents in the last 2 months)

The problem is as illustrated, Agents often have absolutely no understanding of the technical aspects of the role they are trying to fill, or the clients skillsets. As times get harder the margins seem to be getting higher , not lower. What value does your average agent add (I know 2 decent agents in 8 years of the game)

I wish you the best, but for me its hot air , I've never done business over IRC or MSN chat or whatever buzzy social networking thing and doubt my clients will be doing it in a hurry either.

The only thing i've heard about social networking is that i might help cut out the middle man.. Eg the agent.

If I'm wrong in the opinions I've gained from a few posts, fair enough.

[The Agents View]

I don't understand you, in 1 respect you are saying that people are at fault for not engaging in verbal communication and then saying two posts later that we need to adapt to? Linkedin?

in my opinion, LinkedIn is only really useful to agents to mine, you'd love us to list our clients with recommendations from our hiring managers.

I've had so much trouble with agents linking to me and then hassling MY customers.

Linked in is all or nothing, totally open in order to get new leads, or closed only to those you've already done business with, who already know you.

So entertain me, how do I adapt - specifically?

What does a guy with experience working at Microsoft premier support as a SME have to do to get put forward for a Wintel support / project role?

Yes and no. With the way communication has changed over the past 10 years, direct communication actually has a different meaning as well.

You can directly communicate with me, using e-mail, telephone, Skype chat, SMS and if you really want to, Face Time....Oh and you can also catch me at quite a few networking events, face to face - and if you ask nicely, I'll have a coffee with you, if you work in my industry sector (which is not actually IT orientated, so is probably not of interest to you lot!)

Hassling your customers? They're not hassling YOUR customers. Everyone has to make a living, and if they didn't find the details through you, they'd have found them through other means - so get that bee out of your bonnet, and ask yourself how you ended up in touch with those clients in the first place.....I would bet good money it wasn't by chance.

Personally, my connections are closed.

Re: your last question. I don't really understand what the jargony bit means, however, I THINK what you're asking, is how you get a job that you can't demonstrate any history of performing effectively.

The answer to that, is to point out that people, in the majority, hire contractors to be the person who has been there, and done it, not to pay them extortionate amounts of money to learn on the job and get experience - that's what they pay permies for.

If what you want to do is something different to your main skill set, you need to go back to career mode, and get a company to invest in you so that you can BE the consultant in that area. I'm afraid that probably means going back to permiedom, and coming back as a contractor when you have something to sell to them - In the meantime, if the choice is someone who's done it before, or someone who has done something similar but can't guarantee results - I can guess which way that decision is going to go in the middle of a recession.....

[pmeswani]

This is business. Businesses change, and you're not keeping up with the times.

Think about it - how many of the following have you changed in the last 6 years:

• Phone
• PC/Laptop
• Car

And why? Because things have changed, and in order to adapt to that change, you need different tools.

6 Years ago, LinkedIn was in its infancy for example - now if you don't have a LinkedIn profile, people look at you funny....

Add that to measures of austerity, meaning the agents job is more about finding vacancies, than resourcing them at the moment, and you realise that it's not the agent who is at fault for doing things differently - it's yours for not adapting to different market conditions.

I would be happy to use a phone or laptop that was more than 6 years old, as long as it met my minimum requirements (old phone to make phone calls, old laptop to surf the interweb and check emails).

To date, none of my clients who have interviewed me have checked my LinkedIn profile or asked me to explain any descrepancy between my LinkedIn profile and my CV.

I don't ask people to give me references on LinkedIn as it is very biased towards positive feedback and the system used to provide references on LinkedIn is flawed in that I can create fake contacts and provide fake references in order to give a false impression of my abilities. Are you seriously telling me that you would gladly accept a LinkedIn reference over any other type of reference? If agencies want references, they can speak to other agencies to confirm I have worked for the said client and ask them for feedback. If they don't like it, I'll look for another contract.

You may wish to discredit me on my point above for now, but in time people will take LinkedIn references as unreliable.

For as long as Jobserve, Jobsite, Planetrecruit and other job boards are still around, I will continue to use these boards to find jobs. If you want to use LinkedIn, go for it. If you find me via LinkedIn, I would gladly speak to you, as long as you take my CV as gospel over my LinkedIn profile.

[The Agents View]

Don't mean to be rude TAV, but every time I call an agent, I get told that the agent I want to speak to is in a meeting or has no interest in speaking to candidates. Nowt to do with candidates not being able to communicate, but with agents not wanting to speak to every candidate who calls up, as this prevents them from getting their day jobs done.

As above - the onset of more effective professional level social media, means that alot of the time, there is less requirement to speak to people. I'm not saying that's the right way to go about things (I still subscribe to speaking directly to people, and meeting them face to face when I can!) but it is the reality. Given that fact, I'd be thinking more along the lines of how I can get the attention of the right people (agents/direct clients etc) - rather than berating agents for not speaking to you.

Regarding speaking to end clients? From time to time I get contacted by contacts I have within the field asking if I want to come back, but not as a contractor.

Dangerous point that - if people don't expect to use someone with your skill set as a contractor, then I'd question the wisdom of building a business around it.

I use LinkedIn, and have been contacted by various companies to do some work, but mainly perm roles. I don't use LinkedIn to source out contract roles as one has to subscribe to too many groups just to find 1 role. Plus the amount of Spam that gets posted on LinkedIn, it makes it unattractive.

Again - it comes down to adapting. If the only place there are jobs, is LinkedIn, then LinkedIn is the tool you choose.

I don't fancy picking up the phone and cold calling, it's not my thing. I'll communicate via interviews and applying for roles on Job Boards. If you can't afford to post on Job Boards, then don't.

Can't afford to post on Job Boards? Are you seriously suggesting that the reason I don't use them is because of money?? If they were effective, they'd pay for themselves. Because they are not effective, I choose not to spend money on them. Again, it's all about using the right business tools.

Job boards such as Jobserve is the only practical way that a lot of contractors can get onto the books.

Mainly it's a practical way to increase frustration, ensure massive competition, and grow your bench time actually. The secret is getting in front of a company and positioning a role that just "happens" to be within your skill set - influence the job to fit your skills - not your skills to fit the job.

[Scoobos]

I don't understand you, in 1 respect you are saying that people are at fault for not engaging in verbal communication and then saying two posts later that we need to adapt to? Linkedin?

in my opinion, LinkedIn is only really useful to agents to mine, you'd love us to list our clients with recommendations from our hiring managers.

I've had so much trouble with agents linking to me and then hassling MY customers.

Linked in is all or nothing, totally open in order to get new leads, or closed only to those you've already done business with, who already know you.

So entertain me, how do I adapt - specifically?

What does a guy with experience working at Microsoft premier support as a SME have to do to get put forward for a Wintel support / project role?

[The Agents View]

I'm pleased for you and agree with the sentiment. Big but though :

I used to have the following strategy that worked well 5 or 6 years ago and follows your thinking:

1. Spot job or hear about job, find approved supplier / agent.
2. Fire off CV tailored to the information I have from JS or the grapevine.
3. Call them and discuss any point (even when I dont need info) to entice them to take a look at CV
4. Offer time to read, or go over the role - or offer to tailor a CV directly to an internal job spec
5. Get Interview - Get Role (I've NEVER failed an interview)


Now I'm finding its

Do step 1 and 2 , then get bs'ed at step 3 - unable to contact agent for a role I could walk into.
I've still not ever failed an interview (had over 30 too, in 5 different countries) and yet I don't get put forward.

Then get called back by the same agent for a TOTALLY unrelated role and have a quick chat about how he knows my phone from when he worked in carphone warehouse last year.

I should add that I am in contract right now, but had 4 months of this previous.

Jus' sayin....

This is business. Businesses change, and you're not keeping up with the times.

Think about it - how many of the following have you changed in the last 6 years:

• Phone
• PC/Laptop
• Car

And why? Because things have changed, and in order to adapt to that change, you need different tools.

6 Years ago, LinkedIn was in its infancy for example - now if you don't have a LinkedIn profile, people look at you funny....

Add that to measures of austerity, meaning the agents job is more about finding vacancies, than resourcing them at the moment, and you realise that it's not the agent who is at fault for doing things differently - it's yours for not adapting to different market conditions.

[Scoobos]

Actually yes.

Candidates should be networking - speaking to end clients, speaking to agents, directly communicating! Use LinkedIn, Use all these other resources which are there for you.

I'm pleased for you and agree with the sentiment. Big but though :

I used to have the following strategy that worked well 5 or 6 years ago and follows your thinking:

1. Spot job or hear about job, find approved supplier / agent.
2. Fire off CV tailored to the information I have from JS or the grapevine.
3. Call them and discuss any point (even when I dont need info) to entice them to take a look at CV
4. Offer time to read, or go over the role - or offer to tailor a CV directly to an internal job spec
5. Get Interview - Get Role (I've NEVER failed an interview)


Now I'm finding its

Do step 1 and 2 , then get bs'ed at step 3 - unable to contact agent for a role I could walk into.
I've still not ever failed an interview (had over 30 too, in 5 different countries) and yet I don't get put forward.

Then get called back by the same agent for a TOTALLY unrelated role and have a quick chat about how he knows my phone from when he worked in carphone warehouse last year.

I should add that I am in contract right now, but had 4 months of this previous.

Jus' sayin....

[norrahe]

I've noticed this too. Can you recommend any specialist interim sites to find such gigs, mainland Europe or otherwise?

This is a good one for NL and BE:

freelance.nl - de match tussen freelancer en opdrachtgever.

[pmeswani]

Actually yes.

Candidates should be networking - speaking to end clients, speaking to agents, directly communicating! Use LinkedIn, Use all these other resources which are there for you. Jobserve is a crock of **** - for both agents and candidates - in times of Austerity, those who survive, aren't going to be the "best contractors" - they're going to be the ones who are the best at communicating!

As an example - in the last 12 months, I've set up my own agency - I have so far, not required any subscriptions to any job boards..... I can find what I need just as easily by networking and using professional social media.

Don't mean to be rude TAV, but every time I call an agent, I get told that the agent I want to speak to is in a meeting or has no interest in speaking to candidates. Nowt to do with candidates not being able to communicate, but with agents not wanting to speak to every candidate who calls up, as this prevents them from getting their day jobs done.

Regarding speaking to end clients? From time to time I get contacted by contacts I have within the field asking if I want to come back, but not as a contractor.

I use LinkedIn, and have been contacted by various companies to do some work, but mainly perm roles. I don't use LinkedIn to source out contract roles as one has to subscribe to too many groups just to find 1 role. Plus the amount of Spam that gets posted on LinkedIn, it makes it unattractive.

I don't fancy picking up the phone and cold calling, it's not my thing. I'll communicate via interviews and applying for roles on Job Boards. If you can't afford to post on Job Boards, then don't.

Job boards such as Jobserve is the only practical way that a lot of contractors can get onto the books.

[The Agents View]

Yes, it's the candidates fault for using Jobserve.

Actually yes.

Candidates should be networking - speaking to end clients, speaking to agents, directly communicating! Use LinkedIn, Use all these other resources which are there for you. Jobserve is a crock of **** - for both agents and candidates - in times of Austerity, those who survive, aren't going to be the "best contractors" - they're going to be the ones who are the best at communicating!

As an example - in the last 12 months, I've set up my own agency - I have so far, not required any subscriptions to any job boards..... I can find what I need just as easily by networking and using professional social media.

[pmeswani]

Most of the gigs are either on LinkedIn or specialist interim sites. Jobswerve is becoming a tad redundant these days especially if you are looking for mainland Europe gigs.

To most extent I agree. I still use Jobswerve to find my contract roles as I cannot be bothered to go through all the groups to find my next role.... But I must admit I am getting more contact through LinkedIn over the last few months than I have done this time last year.