Reply to: Negotiating with agents

[wantacontract]

I try to give a range - and add to it my rate depends on location of the client and my expenses....

always say bit pointless if I can't even get an interview, as ultimately the rate negotiation is with you and the agent, the total day rate has already been agreed between the client and the agency.....

[Lambert Simnel]

My tuppence - I work in banking and budgets are always estimated at high level, so if a role is advertised at 450-550 I don't care if I pay 550 for every person I hire. To be honest, if someone comes through at 450 then I assume they're junior - I just want the best people I can get within whatever the range is

I'd suggest always asking for the top of the range. If it's not a big bank doing the hiring maybe they will care but then they can try and negotiate down from there

I've the same experience in Banking. By the time the hiring manager has actually got a role approved and a budget assigned, there's not much benefit in it for them to save the organisation as a whole some money. You just get the best worker you can do within your range, and that means it's more likely to be at the top end.

[jmo21]

Interesting. Genuine question: Why?

Missed out the word 'not', edited now.

[SueEllen]

Interesting. Genuine question: Why?

To know about the state of the market.

Contracts can get canned at anytime so you need to keep an eye on what is happening.

[billybiro]

Which is fine, as they dress it up as what rates shouldn't I call you about. When I'm in contract I do want to hear about it even if it's low!

Interesting. Genuine question: Why?

[jmo21]

Agent: "Hi, is that jmo21?"
jmo21: "Yes, who's that?"
Agent: "It's Slippery Simon from Shyster Recruitment here. What is your current rate?"
jmo21: "I'm sorry, I don't discuss rate until I am discussing a live role."
Agent: "No problem. Bye."
[hangs up phone]
Agent: "I'll just put £150 down in this spreadsheet column"

Which is fine, as they dress it up as what rates shouldn't I call you about. When I'm in not contract I do want to hear about it even if it's low!

[MrMarkyMark]

^^This

As long as you know what the range is then do the interview and negotiate afterwards. As long as you don't think that you can negotiate well above the initial top budget (that's just called being a timewaster)

When I have done this, I did it prior to any interview.
I told the agent I would only do it for £xxx, as a minimum, which was over the initial proposed maximum.

Luckily the client had a rethink and said they would meet my budget.

[Agent]

Leave rate negotiations till after the interview, then you will understand how much of a ball ache the contract will be and the client will understand how much they want you, agent loses some of their power then

^^This

As long as you know what the range is then do the interview and negotiate afterwards. As long as you don't think that you can negotiate well above the initial top budget (that's just called being a timewaster)

[TanyaWWW]

Always ask for top of range

My tuppence - I work in banking and budgets are always estimated at high level, so if a role is advertised at 450-550 I don't care if I pay 550 for every person I hire. To be honest, if someone comes through at 450 then I assume they're junior - I just want the best people I can get within whatever the range is

I'd suggest always asking for the top of the range. If it's not a big bank doing the hiring maybe they will care but then they can try and negotiate down from there

Also if an agent asks what rate I'm on, I tell them the best rate I've ever had, and tell them it would take more to move me. Yesterday I had a second interview at a rate over 30% more than what I'm on... the world is not a meritocracy and you're only worth whatever you can swindle

[billybiro]

Agent: "Hi, is that jmo21?"
jmo21: "Yes, who's that?"
Agent: "It's Slippery Simon from Shyster Recruitment here. I am recruiting for a contract widget builder ..."
jmo21: "I'm sorry, I am currently in a contract and too busy to talk right now but.."
Agent: "No problem. Bye."
[hangs up phone]
Agent: "I'll just put £150 down in this minimum rate spreadsheet column"

FTFY

[SueEllen]

Agent: "Hi, is that jmo21?"
jmo21: "Yes, who's that?"
Agent: "It's Slippery Simon from Shyster Recruitment here. I am recruiting for a contract widget builder ..."
jmo21: "I'm sorry, I am currently in a contract and too busy to talk right now but.."
Agent: "No problem. Bye."
[hangs up phone]

FTFY

[billybiro]

This.

Plus, whenever I chat to agents when I am not on the market, and they ask what my rate is, I tell them I don't discuss rates until I am discussing a live role I want to apply for, as it depends on a lot of things.

I don't want a number next to my name in their database/spreadsheet that might stop me getting a call when I am looking as some point in the future when my rate requirement may have changed.

Agent: "Hi, is that jmo21?"
jmo21: "Yes, who's that?"
Agent: "It's Slippery Simon from Shyster Recruitment here. What is your current rate?"
jmo21: "I'm sorry, I don't discuss rate until I am discussing a live role."
Agent: "No problem. Bye."
[hangs up phone]
Agent: "I'll just put £150 down in this spreadsheet column"

[jmo21]

My rate varies depending on level of effort to do the job, commuting, my interest in the work, etc. I have a spreadsheet of all my commitments that helps me determine the absolute minimum to charge, based on a 40 week year.

I tend to take the advertised rate as a guide to whether I want to even apply for it. If it's too low, I don't even bother. All the while I have the luxury of being picky, I will. If circumstances change, I'll drop my rate if really necessary.

This.

Plus, whenever I chat to agents when I am not on the market, and they ask what my rate is, I tell them I don't discuss rates until I am discussing a live role I want to apply for, as it depends on a lot of things.

I don't want a number next to my name in their database/spreadsheet that might stop me getting a call when I am looking as some point in the future when my rate requirement may have changed.

[ladymuck]

My rate varies depending on level of effort to do the job, commuting, my interest in the work, etc. I have a spreadsheet of all my commitments that helps me determine the absolute minimum to charge, based on a 40 week year.

I tend to take the advertised rate as a guide to whether I want to even apply for it. If it's too low, I don't even bother. All the while I have the luxury of being picky, I will. If circumstances change, I'll drop my rate if really necessary.

[MrMarkyMark]

+1. My last client continually stated that all the candidates arrived at the same rate.

My reply was that it was far less than I usually get but wanted it as the worked filled in a gap in my CV and it was more interesting than the other options.

My very first contract was with a woman who had already been contracting for 15 years.

One thing she said to me, "If you want to be successful at this for a long time, never fix your rate" very wise advice, IMO.