Reply to: Margaret Thatcher predicts the mess of the EU

[shaunbhoy]

What about getting rid of the ones in Westminster?

In a great many cases, that is earmarked for 3 weeks time,

HTH

[CryingSheep]

C'mon fella get with the programme...

Whilst no politicians would be good, reality is we do need some.

Just a shame there seems to be so few honest ones.

What about getting rid of the ones in Westminster?

[original PM]

So why can't we just do away with the Westminster politicians?

C'mon fella get with the programme...

Whilst no politicians would be good, reality is we do need some.

Just a shame there seems to be so few honest ones.

[Zigenare]

So why can't we just do away with the Westminster politicians?

You've not quite grasped this "Taking Back Control" thing, have you?

[BrilloPad]

Yes that is one of the reasons - but it is mainly just a by product of the fact we want less and not more politicians we have to fund interfering in our lives for their own benefit.

So why can't we just do away with the Westminster politicians?

[original PM]

So main reason to support Brexit went from 'get back control' to 'remove excuses to our politicians for not doing what they should'

Fair enough...

Yes that is one of the reasons - but it is mainly just a by product of the fact we want less and not more politicians we have to fund interfering in our lives for their own benefit.

[CryingSheep]

The Uk has at times been not doing it's duty regarding managing immigration and they have at times stated that the 'EU' told them to.

We know this is not true so leaving the EU simply removes excuses our politicians can make for not properly managing immigration.

And as well agree we need proper immigration controls.

So main reason to support Brexit went from 'get back control' to 'remove excuses to our politicians for not doing what they should'

Fair enough...

[original PM]

So, now that we went pass the obvious, can you (or someone with similar views) explain why any of this is EU fault/responsibility or how any of this will change with UK leaving the EU!?

!

The Uk has at times been not doing it's duty regarding managing immigration and they have at times stated that the 'EU' told them to.

We know this is not true so leaving the EU simply removes excuses our politicians can make for not properly managing immigration.

And as well agree we need proper immigration controls.

[CryingSheep]

Well rather than just taking blanket figures which suit your narrative and quoting them why not apply just a small amount of logic.

So illegal immigrants cannot work in the UK as they do not have the correct paperwork therefore those people are clearly not going to be contributing anything.

However surely somewhere these immigrants need to live and get some form of nourishment which probably means they are working illegally - normally with someone they know who is a legal immigrant.

So you could argue yes the legal immigrant is potentially putting more money into the pot than the locals - but how many illegal immigrants are working in this manner which takes money out of the put and lowers the overall 'benefit' provided by immigrants?

But the main thing is you cannot compared the 'usefulness' of the average native citizen to the average 'immigrant' as there are far to many variables to take into account.

I even had to check the title of the thread cause I got completely lost in all this BS.

- So illegal immigrants are damaging the UK economy and this needs to be tackled - We can ALL agree on that (lets move on)

- Legal immigrants (specially the ones from the EU) contribute more to the UK economy than the average native - Most of us agree with this (including you, apparently - lets move on)

- I don't know what you mean by 'usefulness', but I risk to say whatever it is, the average legal immigrant as more 'usefulness' than average native! - Not everyone will agree on this one, but utterly irrelevant (lets move on)

So, now that we went pass the obvious, can you (or someone with similar views) explain why any of this is EU fault/responsibility or how any of this will change with UK leaving the EU!?

p.s. - the usual "we can get back control of our borders" won't apply here as UK does have control of their own borders, especially to limit/block entrance of illegal immigrants!!! I'm pretty sure there isn't any EU law that states the UK border needs to allow xxx thousand illegal immigrants every year, or that UK border control must be incompetent on stopping illegal immigrants at their borders!

[BrilloPad]

Yes, next time England play Germany in the world cup I'll expect Shilton in goal and Butcher playing sweeper. Totally fair.

I prefer Banks in goal....

[Cirrus]

So illegal immigrants cannot work in the UK as they do not have the correct paperwork therefore those people are clearly not going to be contributing anything.

Tell that to the Chinese takeaway in the next town to me. They were raided by the Border Force and had 4 illegals working there. Out-stayed their visitor visas or some such.

[original PM]

But that exactly how you should compare!!! And I think your answer just explains pretty well why migration is usually positive for a country economy, so why all the fuss?

Anyway, because of thick people like you, there are other studies that only compare with actively working natives and still migrants have a higher contribution!

Well rather than just taking blanket figures which suit your narrative and quoting them why not apply just a small amount of logic.

So illegal immigrants cannot work in the UK as they do not have the correct paperwork therefore those people are clearly not going to be contributing anything.

However surely somewhere these immigrants need to live and get some form of nourishment which probably means they are working illegally - normally with someone they know who is a legal immigrant.

So you could argue yes the legal immigrant is potentially putting more money into the pot than the locals - but how many illegal immigrants are working in this manner which takes money out of the put and lowers the overall 'benefit' provided by immigrants?

But the main thing is you cannot compared the 'usefulness' of the average native citizen to the average 'immigrant' as there are far to many variables to take into account.

[CryingSheep]

Yes, next time England play Germany in the world cup I'll expect Shilton in goal and Butcher playing sweeper. Totally fair.

I see that if something doesn't support your (thick) views than it can't be fair... Now that seems fair!

[minestrone]

But that exactly how you should compare!!! And I think your answer just explains pretty well why migration is usually positive for a country economy, so why all the fuss?

Anyway, because of thick people like you, there are other studies that only compare with actively working natives and still migrants have a higher contribution!

Yes, next time England play Germany in the world cup I'll expect Shilton in goal and Butcher playing sweeper. Totally fair.

[CryingSheep]

"In 2016/17, the average adult migrant from the European Economic Area (EEA) contributed approximately £2,300 more to UK public finances than the average adult currently living in the UK"

So they have compared migrants who are predominantly of working age to the native population with 12 million retirees.

Outstanding.

But that exactly how you should compare!!! And I think your answer just explains pretty well why migration is usually positive for a country economy, so why all the fuss?

Anyway, because of thick people like you, there are other studies that only compare with actively working natives and still migrants have a higher contribution!