Legit I am

[Lewis]

Ignorance of the law is no defence.

You may have been mislead, but the sad and harsh reality is that it is your problem, not the umbrella companies problem. In an investigation it is you who will be accused and found guilty of making fraudulent expense claims, not the umbrella and saying "But I didn't realise I was scamming..." will not change this one little bit.

Absolutely. I was only trying to make the point that calling someone a scammer sort of implies they did it knowingly whereas I think a lot of people did it because they thought it was allowed. But yes, ignorance is no excuse in the eyes of the law, it's now their problem. I just don't see the point of calling them scammers when they are asking for assistance to get out of the situation. Shame companies like Giant can't be sued - not only did they say receipts were not required but their system didn't allow the entry of anything other than the full daily allowance! So it was either the full daily amount or nothing. If you wanted to claim just £2.95 for a sandwich you couldn't! It has since changed of course. I do wonder what prompted Giant to change it and demand receipts, did they lose their dispensation? They say not.

[Ardesco]

Ignorance of the law is no defence.

You may have been mislead, but the sad and harsh reality is that it is your problem, not the umbrella companies problem. In an investigation it is you who will be accused and found guilty of making fraudulent expense claims, not the umbrella and saying "But I didn't realise I was scamming..." will not change this one little bit.

[Lewis]

you were trying to scam your expenses.

I think that is a little harsh. It is Giant who have mislead contractors into believing they were allowed to claim these daily allowances as a 'dispensation' given by the revenue. I think the majority of people, had they have known the real situation would not have claimed. How many people post here saying "I didn't know, I am worried, what can I do?". They are not scammers. They have been mislead by Giant and are trying to find a way out. I suspect that their worry is probably because the are more honest than most not less!

[Lewis]

You take the value of expenses you have claimed and add that to the amount of money you have been paid and then put that on your self assessment form. You are then told you owe £XXX.xx amount of tax which you pay. You have now not claimed expenses that you never incurred and have paid the correct amount of tax without telling El Gordo that you were trying to scam your expenses.

nice and simple with no comeback and means that you don't have to worry if you have a investigation in the future.

Ok I see the point, but that only covers one year though. Giant have been allowing unreceipted expenses for many years.

[Ardesco]

I don't see what self-assessment has to do with it. As far as I can tell if you have claimed but don't have receipts you will only have problems during an investigation.

You take the value of expenses you have claimed and add that to the amount of money you have been paid and then put that on your self assessment form. You are then told you owe £XXX.xx amount of tax which you pay. You have now not claimed expenses that you never incurred and have paid the correct amount of tax without telling El Gordo that you were trying to scam your expenses.

nice and simple with no comeback and means that you don't have to worry if you have a investigation in the future.

[Lewis]

damo,

i used to be with Giant, and claimed all the subsistence (as advised by Giant!) without receipts. like you, i now realise this was wrong, i've posted about this before, and the gist of the replies was 'complete a self-assessment'.

I don't see what self-assessment has to do with it. As far as I can tell if you have claimed but don't have receipts you will only have problems during an investigation.

If it was me I would then explain to the tax man that unfortunately you didn't keep receipts as Giant said not to. The tax man may then disallow the expenses and ask you to pay some extra tax. Whether he gets heavy and applies interest and penalties I don't know.

But in terms of practical things you can do now. As far as I am aware you don't need to put these expenses on your self-assessment form.

I can't see it being to your advantage to inform the tax man you have no receipts as that will presumably just lead to investigation anwyay (time and hassle). So I reckon you just keep quite, hope the tax man doesn't come knocking and if he does expain the situation with Giant's advice (afterall Giant was your employer and so you can't be punished too heavily for following their instrictions - in my opinion anyway).

[Burdock]

damo,

i used to be with Giant, and claimed all the subsistence (as advised by Giant!) without receipts. like you, i now realise this was wrong, i've posted about this before, and the gist of the replies was 'complete a self-assessment'.

[Bluebird]

What do you mean clean slate??....I thought I still had to keep hold of receipts etc for at least 3 if not the same 6. Hence my panic, Mr 'Wet behind the Ears' here got into a managed limited company and not until coming up towards the abolishment of MSCs had any idea I was doing anything wrong as so many people had gone that way before me. I am just wanting to know how much longer I have to keep looking over my shoulder. Due to 3 months out of work near the start of the year and my wages since I certainly won't have exceeded £30k, maximum £27-£28. Expenses minimal really, low subsisitence for 4 months and 4000 miles.

The more annoying part is I am worrying big time, yet colleagues are bludgeoning on regardless having moved from MSC's to Umbrellas and still claiming unreceipted subsistence and one made me laugh she puts ink cartridges through as an expense even though her job is on a helpdesk and doesn't need ink LOL and someone else claiming £5 postage a day! Hilarious in my opinion.

were you paid dividends as well as salary ?

[Damo1176]

chill out.

Lots of people went down the MSC route..minimised tax and effort. Hats off!

At least you get to start with a clean sheet..ltd co's have 6 years of history to defend.

What do you mean clean slate??....I thought I still had to keep hold of receipts etc for at least 3 if not the same 6.

[max]

Thank you so much everyone for all their input and responses, I have been simply overwhelmed....NOT!

Is it because you don't think its worthb responding too, you don't know the answser or did me saying I am ex MSC make you all vomit, usually I have found this forum extreely helpful but erm, darwn a blank here.

chill out.

Lots of people went down the MSC route..minimised tax and effort. Hats off!

At least you get to start with a clean sheet..ltd co's have 6 years of history to defend.

[Epiphone]

Ask your brolly. they won't do the SA for you (without you paying them anyway) but they'll be able to tell you if, in their opinion, you should do one.

[ASB]

You need to fill in a self asessment return if you have any income that has not been fully taxed. Or hector send you one.

Common examples are anybody who has:-

Enough income to be in higher rate tax
A director
Property income
Anybody paying into certain types on pension (to reclaim in this case) e.g. a section 226 retirement policy
Income from overseas

It's a bore, but you can find out from HMRC website. But if your only income is PAYE of < 30k you probably don't need to fill in a tax return. Unfortunately it's your responsibility to work it out.

[oraclesmith]

The fact is, no-one can put your mind at rest. If all you want is someone to say 'it's alright, no-one will investigate you' then you're on to a hiding to nothing.

[Damo1176]

Thank you so much everyone for all their input and responses, I have been simply overwhelmed....NOT!

Is it because you don't think its worthb responding too, you don't know the answser or did me saying I am ex MSC make you all vomit, usually I have found this forum extreely helpful but erm, darwn a blank here.

[damo111176]

Hi Folks

My last note, I now unlike many do not claim subsistence just mileage and operate through an umbrella. However I am a little worried about my history. From late Aug 2006 I worked for Giant under an MSC after advice from a fellow contractor. Never been near this site until around March/April and despite reading the threat of April I continued to used the MSC as long as I could.

My overall salary for last year was well under £30k.

What I want to know is where I stand with Hector. Is it likely that now I am working through an umbrella by the book that he could still knock on my door. I also hear of self assessment but I understood that I don't need to do this as I have not earned over £34k and I was not the director of the limited company.

Can someone PLEASE put my mind at rest once and for all.