Oh dear, we're falling out of the sky

[Sysman]

Have you seen how an airbus is flown?

Straight into a building?

[wim121]

Exactly my point - the guy had 3000+ hours total flight time and countless hours in a sim. You don't get into the right hand seat for a major carrier unless you're highly capable. It's akin to forgetting how to walk when it's raining

Hahahaha exactly. Love the simile btw, very well put.

[suityou01]

Couple of points. Why did the plane except dual inputs, and then use the net effect of the two inputs (effectively cancelling each other out)? Bad design surely?

A simple bulb to illuminate which stick is in control oughta do it.

I recall a crash some years ago where the pilot and co-pilot had an argument. The captain said "Cheer up" to his colleage which he heard as "Gear up". Again totally avoidable.

[wim121]

I recall a crash some years ago where the pilot and co-pilot had an argument. The captain said "Cheer up" to his colleage which he heard as "Gear up". Again totally avoidable.

Reminds me of this video ...... (wouldnt let me embed)

Simpsons: Pilot Homer | MilkandCookies

[Cliphead]

Couple of points. Why did the plane except dual inputs, and then use the net effect of the two inputs (effectively cancelling each other out)? Bad design surely?

A simple bulb to illuminate which stick is in control oughta do it.

I recall a crash some years ago where the pilot and co-pilot had an argument. The captain said "Cheer up" to his colleage which he heard as "Gear up". Again totally avoidable.

Disregarding stick input and averages there were other indicators to the crew that would have given them a clearer picture of the situation. So pitot icing nixed the airspeed indicator, the GPS groundspeed indication would have covered that taking into account wind speed and direction at their altitude. The weather radar would provide some input about those factors as well as indicating severe weather ahead which should have been avoided.

Ignoring a stall warning for the length of time that they did is unbelievable.

There was the crash of a cargo plane a few years ago when the captain had incorrectly set the altitude hold on the autopilot, the inexperienced copilot pointed this out several times which the captain ignored and joked with the flight engineer "what's the difference between a copilot and a duck? A duck can fly", right before they hit a mountain. Crew resource management and communication changes were made after that crash but apparently the lessons went unheeded by this crew.

[centurian]

There was the crash of a cargo plane a few years ago when the captain had incorrectly set the altitude hold on the autopilot, the inexperienced copilot pointed this out several times which the captain ignored and joked with the flight engineer "what's the difference between a copilot and a duck? A duck can fly", right before they hit a mountain. Crew resource management and communication changes were made after that crash but apparently the lessons went unheeded by this crew.

That was also a major factor in the worst ever air disaster - two 747's colliding on the runway at Tenerife.

KLM captain was one of the most senior pilots in the entire airline. The most junior person on the flight deck, the flight engineer spotted the danger and tried to warn the captain, who instantly slapped him down - 30 seconds later, everyone on that plane was dead, along with most of those on the Pam AM

[Cliphead]

That was also a major factor in the worst ever air disaster - two 747's colliding on the runway at Tenerife.

KLM captain was one of the most senior pilots in the entire airline. The most junior person on the flight deck, the flight engineer spotted the danger and tried to warn the captain, who instantly slapped him down - 30 seconds later, everyone on that plane was dead, along with most of those on the Pam AM

Yes, similar cockpit circumstances though different situations. In all of these accidents perfectly serviceable aircraft crashed and people killed because of pilot incompetence.

[Cliphead]

A wee reminder to myself, fellow and non aviators what airmanship means.

Airmanship is skill and knowledge applied to aerial navigation, similar to seamanship in maritime navigation. Airmanship covers a broad range of desirable behaviors and abilities in an aviator. It is not simply a measure of skill or technique, but also a measure of a pilot’s awareness of the aircraft, the environment in which it operates, and of his own capabilities.

Airmanship can be defined as:

• A sound acquaintance with the principles of flight,
• The ability to operate an airplane with competence and precision both on the ground and in the air, and
• The exercise of sound judgment that results in optimal operational safety and efficiency.

The three fundamental principles of expert airmanship are skill, proficiency, and the discipline to apply them in a safe and efficient manner. Discipline is the foundation of airmanship. The complexity of the aviation environment demands a foundation of solid airmanship, and a healthy, positive approach to combating pilot error.

[zeitghost]

Feck me, watched the programme on 4 last evening at 20:00 about this.

The right seat had the control stick all the way back from 35,000 feet down to impact.

Stunning.

[Scoobos]

That does seem to be a design issue with Airbus. Also, when there are conflicting instructions on the joystick, that the plane averages the two rather than giving some kind of warning that the pilots are giving contradictory instructions.

just... wow...