Question Time last night

[Doggy Styles]

However I can't understand why people like Fred Goodwin aren't in prison for almost causing financial collapse, his income was high because he was responsible for a large bank, so he should be made to take responsibility of the problems his bank has caused.

I'm not an expert, but perhaps he isn't in prison because he didn't break the law.

He was blackballed for membership at St Andrews golf club though.

[Freamon]

Jesus, you're boring when you start droning on about bankers, a one-man Question Time audience distilled into a single dreary individual.

It's absolutely natural, futile to try and change, and childishly naive even to think about it. The same wealth and/or power distribution holds, and always has, in every society, medieval barons, communist apparachiks, even drug dealers.

It even holds for the energy of gas molecules, in the Maxwell-Boltzmann Distribution. So you are practically railing against a fundamental law of physics!

Not really true - income distribution is far wider than it was in the 1950s. We're back at a peak of income distribution skew that hasn't been seen since the late 1920s. Remember what happened after that?



I agree it is futile to try and change it though. It's attitudes and culture that affect this stuff, and nobody has the power to change or steer those. See: Kondratiev wave - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Peoplesoft bloke]

To which he should ask the question are you worth 40 times more than a Somalian peasant?

Only if he wanted to appear as a man devoid of any capability for intellectual thought or logical reasoning.

Ha, good retort DA. I'll remember that.

What's good about that? You might as well ask if David Icke is worth more than a hatstand.

On this board anyone who dares to question the received wisdom that obscene disparities in pay, based in no way at all on any form of wealth generation or other merit are compulsory is immediately slapped-down with childish insults. Have a look at yourselves and see if you really think right wing knee-jerk immature gits are any less immature than "immature quasi socialists". There is a serious point here, even if it makes some of you profoundly uncomfortable.

[Hill Station Murthy]

Only if he wanted to appear as a man devoid of any capability for intellectual thought or logical reasoning.



What's good about that? You might as well ask if David Icke is worth more than a hatstand.

On this board anyone who dares to question the received wisdom that obscene disparities in pay, based in no way at all on any form of wealth generation or other merit are compulsory is immediately slapped-down with childish insults. Have a look at yourselves and see if you really think right wing knee-jerk immature gits are any less immature than "immature quasi socialists". There is a serious point here, even if it makes some of you profoundly uncomfortable.

Yes indeed I couldn't agree more.

Have you ever noticed how these right wing people always deny they are right wing? They will always say they are non political. To them only people on the left wing are political.

[DodgyAgent]

Only if he wanted to appear as a man devoid of any capability for intellectual thought or logical reasoning.



What's good about that? You might as well ask if David Icke is worth more than a hatstand.

On this board anyone who dares to question the received wisdom that obscene disparities in pay, based in no way at all on any form of wealth generation or other merit are compulsory is immediately slapped-down with childish insults. Have a look at yourselves and see if you really think right wing knee-jerk immature gits are any less immature than "immature quasi socialists". There is a serious point here, even if it makes some of you profoundly uncomfortable.

There is indeed a serious point here, and the question I want to ask is who decides on what someone is worth? and how is worth to be valued? I just wonder how you have the gall to to tell others to "look at themselves" when of all the workers that earn "too much" money then IT contractors are right up there with the non deserving. Before I go down this one, I personally fully endorse the model that IT contractors are paid. It can however be argued that IT contractors take no responsibility for the work they do. They don't make anything other than more work, they are paid disproportionally high amounts of money just by dint of their "technical" (rather than practical) knowledge, they don't employ people and they pay very little tax.

I am right wing and I am very proud of it. One of the reasons I am right wing is because I believe that people have the right and responsibility to earn whatever they want. I regard (especially wealthy people) socialists or people with a "social conscience" as the worst of hypocrites. These people talk lot about social justice, "fair pay", "equality" and all that but do they dip into their own pockets and do a bit of their own redistribution? No. they love social justice as long as someone else pays for it, and today those people happen to be bankers.

[pacharan]

There is indeed a serious point here, and the question I want to ask is who decides on what someone is worth? and how is worth to be valued? I just wonder how you have the gall to to tell others to "look at themselves" when of all the workers that earn "too much" money then IT contractors are right up there with the non deserving. Before I go down this one, I personally fully endorse the model that IT contractors are paid. It can however be argued that IT contractors take no responsibility for the work they do. They don't make anything other than more work, they are paid disproportionally high amounts of money just by dint of their "technical" (rather than practical) knowledge, they don't employ people and they pay very little tax.

Oh FFS Change the fecking record DA

[DodgyAgent]

Oh FFS Change the fecking record DA

Sorry Pacharan, but I have now included the full Album

[Arturo Bassick]

There is indeed a serious point here, and the question I want to ask is who decides on what someone is worth? and how is worth to be valued? I just wonder how you have the gall to to tell others to "look at themselves" when of all the workers that earn "too much" money then IT contractors are right up there with the non deserving. Before I go down this one, I personally fully endorse the model that IT contractors are paid. It can however be argued that IT contractors take no responsibility for the work they do. They don't make anything other than more work, they are paid disproportionally high amounts of money just by dint of their "technical" (rather than practical) knowledge, they don't employ people and they pay very little tax.

Contractors rates are dictated by the market.

When millions can do your job then you are paid few pennies.
When few can do your job you are paid millions.
Contractors put themselves out there to be purchased at the market rate with no artificial barriers to entry. The competent survive or thrive. The less able become agents. I assume this is the model you agree with.

If you think our technical knowledge is not valuable then throw away or do not use anything that has software in it and see how you survive.
Do you think aircraft would be safer without software engineers? How about train or car braking systems. The list goes on.

[Doggy Styles]

Only if he wanted to appear as a man devoid of any capability for intellectual thought or logical reasoning.



What's good about that? You might as well ask if David Icke is worth more than a hatstand.

On this board anyone who dares to question the received wisdom that obscene disparities in pay, based in no way at all on any form of wealth generation or other merit are compulsory is immediately slapped-down with childish insults. Have a look at yourselves and see if you really think right wing knee-jerk immature gits are any less immature than "immature quasi socialists". There is a serious point here, even if it makes some of you profoundly uncomfortable.

Do you think reducing the pay of executives is going to help the economy? Of course it isn't. Therefore I don't care what they earn, it doesn't affect me.

And what exactly do these protesters want to do? Maximum wage? 90% taxation? Some new body setting remuneration for every person as it sees fit? I could sympathise if they proposed a return to regulations that curbed fiscal mismanagement or some other practical measure, but not pointless envy.

On the other hand, if anyone thinks they are worth the same as executives, let them go out and prove it. Go and earn more. Go and run a company and employ people. Be responsible for perhaps hundreds, perhaps thousands of people. Manufacture things. That would be a lot more useful than just whingeing from the sidelines about other people's good fortune.

[DodgyAgent]

Contractors rates are dictated by the market.

When millions can do your job then you are paid few pennies.
When few can do your job you are paid millions.
Contractors put themselves out there to be purchased at the market rate with no artificial barriers to entry. The competent survive or thrive. The less able become agents. I assume this is the model you agree with.

If you think our technical knowledge is not valuable then throw away or do not use anything that has software in it and see how you survive.
Do you think aircraft would be safer without software engineers? How about train or car braking systems. The list goes on.

Before I go down this one, I personally fully endorse the model that IT contractors are paid

If you bothered to read what I said you will find that I agree with you (even the bit about agents). I was merely pointing out the hypocrisy of mr Peoplesoft