Ooops: Britain opens its doors to 3.5 million visitors from eastern Europe

[DodgyAgent]

That's not how I read it at all.

Objectors are not encouraging wage inflation. They are against wage deflation.

Keeping what 3 million people out of work? If you mean eastern Europeans, then why should that be our problem?

Add the official UK unemployed to those claiming incapacity benefit and the number is close to 3 million.

[Francko]

Add the official UK unemployed to those claiming incapacity benefit and the number is close to 3 million.

For a country that has almost 60 million people, that's excellent. 5% is like the physiological unemployment. You can't do better than that, most economists would agree.

[DodgyAgent]

I think part of the problem is the little Britain attitude

we have to stop thinking that the whole world revolves around Britain and we have to stop thinking the world ends at Dover.

Britain is part of the European Union, the United States of Europe,
as a member state we can all work where the work is and if we are
so motivated we have the freedom, us Brits as well to go to where
the work gives us the best financial rewards - as our Central and Eastern
European cousins are doing.

So what is the big deal ?

The Poles are doing what Aufiedersen Pet did in the 80's !

All the complaining highlights the fact that British wages are being
drivien down, British people have the same freedom as the Poles
and can if so motivated find work else where within the European
Union where rates for their labour and skills may be higher, through
a combination of wages and cost of living.

So why all the complaining ?

Milan.

You have a point Milan, although what you clearly miss is that the UK is leading the EU enlargement project with its openness and not your precious Germans, French and Italians etc. We are the ones who are letting Eastern Europeans work here and we are the ones who are not putting up protection barriers to foreign businesses wanting to invest in UK companies.

The effect is that foreign capital is coming into this country. Add in our (relatively) flexible labour laws and it is no coincidence that we have so many jobs for people to fill. This is all inspite of NL labours wastefulness and petty interfering.

What Italy Germany and France need is to put an end to job "protection" and make the people fight for their own jobs, it is only then that workers are efficient (the flip side is that they will also have more job opprtunities elsewhere which in turn keeps employers on their toes). That way the consumer markets of France et al will take off giving people more money to spend and more confidence to set up new enterprises.

I am surprised that so many of you have these "protectionist" instincts, no wonder you are not getting on too well with your jobs.

[wendigo100]

I think part of the problem is the little Britain attitude

Not really milan. Even New Labour have stopped using that "last refuge" insult, as they know how ridiculously out of date and inaccurate it is.

In fact, every other country across the EU knew this would happen and bolted their doors PDQ, so perhaps you should aim the Little Englander tag at them. Or rather, Little Italians, Little Frenchmen, and so on.

It isn't a Little Englander attitude, it is a question of numbers causing an imbalance. If it was only a few thousand as HMG predicted, it wouldn't be a problem. But we are talking about another 1% added to our workforce. Furthermore, we haven't got the housing or infrastructure to cope with the sudden rise of people.

[Hart-floot]

That's not how I read it at all.

Objectors are not encouraging wage inflation. They are against wage deflation.

Keeping what 3 million people out of work? If you mean eastern Europeans, then why should that be our problem?

I agree. The problem is one of wage deflation at the moment.

More and more jobs are now paying minimum wage this is starting to hurt many people and will inevitably feed up through the employment food-chain.
Its not only impacting on White-Van man and shelf stackers. For example, students in London looking for term-time work to pay back tuition fees are now only able to find minimum wage jobs this was not the case a few years ago.

[DodgyAgent]

For a country that has almost 60 million people, that's excellent. 5% is like the physiological unemployment. You can't do better than that, most economists would agree.

I think Franco you will find that figures are based on the numbers of the population who are eligible to work which I think stands at about 25 million in the UK. 3 million is a disgrace, and it is a disgrace because paying people to do nothing is the most negative thing a society can do to its people. Why? because it does nothing for the people concerned which these people who become excluded from the job market deeply resent. This is where most of societies social problems come from.

[wendigo100]

Add the official UK unemployed to those claiming incapacity benefit and the number is close to 3 million.

I'm a bit confused by what you are saying. The subject was Eastern Europeans working here. How does getting rid of them mean we will pay more taxes to keep 3 million British people on benefits?

[milanbenes]

a friend of mine in blighty, who is not so fortunate as ourselves to be an IT contractor, considers the minimum wage to now be the maximum wage as he says nobody will pay any higher than the minimum wage

to answer your points, my point is, Brits should stop moaning and go and find jobs abroad too, as some of us have, they might even like it !

in this century, you have to go where the work is

c'est la vie

Milan.

[wendigo100]

a friend of mine in blighty, who is not so fortunate as ourselves to be an IT contractor, considers the minimum wage to now be the maximum wage as he says nobody will pay any higher than the minimum wage

to answer your points, my point is, Brits should stop moaning and go and find jobs abroad too, as some of us have, they might even like it !

in this century, you have to go where the work is

c'est la vie

Milan.

That is a fair point. I have done it in the past.

However, what work are Brits going to find in Poland?

[Joe Black]

You have a point Milan, although what you clearly miss is that the UK is leading the EU enlargement project with its openness and not your precious Germans, French and Italians etc. We are the ones who are letting Eastern Europeans work here and we are the ones who are not putting up protection barriers to foreign businesses wanting to invest in UK companies.

So you'd be quite happy then with state owned monopolies such as Gazprom buying up huge chunks of the market as well I take it.

If completely unfettered access to the UK is meant to be an absolute good, then why not simply drop all restrictions on immigration, foreign companies buying everything they want - surely that's the logical conclusion of these arguments - or like many people do you think there has to be limits.

Brits should stop moaning and go and find jobs abroad too, as some of us have, they might even like it !

in this century, you have to go where the work is

Nice idea, but doubt most Brits/UK companies would have the same access to jobs/markets as others are given to the UK, in which case it ends up seeming a one sided deal.