uk police state wants to hold suspects for 3 months without charge

[sunnysan]

State VS Law

Yes I do see a distinction, but it seems that any mechanisms that are being introduced are giving less power to the judiciary and more power to the state.

IMHO the state is confined to working withing the parameters set by the judiciary.

Lets look at the main points

Outlawing "glorification" of terrorism

WTF is that? If I happen to agree with some points made by a radical Islamic Extremist, am I glorifying terrorism? Is anti western sentiment or anti capitalist rhetoric glorifying terrorism. How do you legally define that statement?


Offence of acts preparatory to terrorism

If I get found with a case of C4 in my cupboard, there must be 100 other laws I can get charged with. Acts commited against the state are treason anyway so why does this need to be extended

Law against giving or receiving terror training

Does attending a Madras constitute terror training? What is terror training? Is it military training? If I learn Arabic am I training myself as a terrorist

New offence against indirect incitement of terrorism

How do you draw the line between free speech and incitement of terror?

Powers to tackle bookshops selling extremist material

Once again what is that? Is it anti western literature, questioning our values or is it firebrand jihadist literature

Using phone-tap evidence in courts being considered

No way. That to me means that anybody can have there phone tapped for any number of vague reasons. If phone taps are admissable as evidence for terrorists , maybe IR will argue that they can use them in fraud investigations or tax evasion or benefit fraud? It basically opens the way for phone taps to be used as evidence in any invetigation. I dont agree with that

Pre-charge detentions powers extended from two weeks to three months

Detention without trial or charge. If the vague terror offences become law, it would be possible to find any reason to detain someone anyway, so why this reinforcement of the state right to lock anybody up for any reason?

Those applying for British citizenship must be "of good character"

Seems like a soundbyte to me. It will create subjectivity in the immigration process. Cant they just create more stringent immigration requirements?



In short I think the proposed changes are too subjective. I realise that ultimately someone will have to assess each case on its individual merits but should that case not be subject to existing precedents? Wil the new laws mean less consultation with the judiciary when deciding what consitutes a terrorist.

IMHO.

[The Late, Great JC]

Using phone-tap evidence in courts being considered

No way. That to me means that anybody can have there phone tapped for any number of vague reasons. If phone taps are admissable as evidence for terrorists , maybe IR will argue that they can use them in fraud investigations or tax evasion or benefit fraud? It basically opens the way for phone taps to be used as evidence in any invetigation. I dont agree with that

The reason that the security services don't want this is because it would reveal the extent of "monitoring" that goes on already.

[John Galt]

Basically New Lie are trying to fix a problem of their own making. It was not so long ago that extremist Muslim clerics were being welcomed with open arms into the UK. Due to the Human Rights Laws (bought in by NL) their every whim and desire has been fulfilled and we have no right to question the content of their 'religious meetings'. NL were so desperate for cultural and religious integration that it was painful to watch. Now some of those extremists have bit the hand that fed them NL are back peddling like fury. No surprise really

[BobTheCrate]

Oh yes. Well bloody said John.

That should be written in marble outside the HoC.

Preferably in large letters so they can be seen above the anti-car bomb concrete slabs.

[wendigo100]

Weren't the government recently telling us that tax avoiders [sic] aided organised criminals and terrorists?

[Not So Wise]

Weren't the government recently telling us that tax avoiders [sic] aided organised criminals and terrorists?

According to the gov everyone, even the single mother nicking baby clothes from Mother care, is somehow financing terrorists and organised crime

[Rebecca Loos]

i think they're also trying to say that:
1. pirated dvds help terrorists
2. downloading songs for free help terrorists
3. in fact anything illegal help terrorists. You are probably helping terrorists when you speed at 71 mph, when you're reading mags for free at whsmith, in fact browsing the web while "at work" probably helps terrorism somewhere!