Recruiter Awards for Excellence 2009

[DodgyAgent]

Without wishing to have a pop, I would suggest that lavish award ceremonies like this are indicative that the industry as a whole is ripping somebody off.
I know you have strong views on the value added side of things, but from my side agents are a cost to my business and rarely do they bring any value to me.

I will remind you that when it comes to perceptions of "ripping people off" you contractors are up there with bankers, fraudsters and tax collectors (ask any IT permie).
There is nothing wrong in agencies making profits-and profit is not the criteria on which these awards are to be dished out. Recruitment is not subsidised, protected or regulated and recruitment businesses stand or fall on how good/profiatble they are. Many contractors on the other hand enjoy huge pay with few responsibilities whilst getting away with being mediocre or of "merchantable quality". Contractors can "ride the tide" "take time off". Agencies on the other hand do not have such luxuries..it is achieve or die, and you will find that for every succesful agency there are 50 that have failed. There is no tolerance of mediocrity.

And whilst you may not think that agencies serve any purpose other than take money from your precious earnings (though I have never understood how someone can pay out money that is not their in the first place, and then say it is "them" that is paying), I challenge you to find a decent sales person let alone pay for one to keep you in work. Also finance people are not easy to find either.

It is thanks to agencies that you guys can do away with a great many overheads involved in running a business, assuming of course that you regard yourselves as businesses which is questionable anyway.

[Bob Dalek]

I will remind you that when it comes to perceptions of "ripping people off" you contractors are up there with bankers, fraudsters and tax collectors (ask any IT permie).
There is nothing wrong in agencies making profits-and profit is not the criteria on which these awards are to be dished out. Recruitment is not subsidised, protected or regulated and recruitment businesses stand or fall on how good/profiatble they are. Many contractors on the other hand enjoy huge pay with few responsibilities whilst getting away with being mediocre or of "merchantable quality". Contractors can "ride the tide" "take time off". Agencies on the other hand do not have such luxuries..it is achieve or die, and you will find that for every succesful agency there are 50 that have failed. There is no tolerance of mediocrity.

And whilst you may not think that agencies serve any purpose other than take money from your precious earnings (though I have never understood how someone can pay out money that is not their in the first place, and then say it is "them" that is paying), I challenge you to find a decent sales person let alone pay for one to keep you in work. Also finance people are not easy to find either.

It is thanks to agencies that you guys can do away with a great many overheads involved in running a business, assuming of course that you regard yourselves as businesses which is questionable anyway.

Straight back at ya, baby!

[DodgyAgent]

Straight back at ya, baby!

[The Lone Gunman]

I will remind you that when it comes to perceptions of "ripping people off" you contractors are up there with bankers, fraudsters and tax collectors (ask any IT permie).
There is nothing wrong in agencies making profits-and profit is not the criteria on which these awards are to be dished out. Recruitment is not subsidised, protected or regulated and recruitment businesses stand or fall on how good/profiatble they are. Many contractors on the other hand enjoy huge pay with few responsibilities whilst getting away with being mediocre or of "merchantable quality". Contractors can "ride the tide" "take time off". Agencies on the other hand do not have such luxuries..it is achieve or die, and you will find that for every succesful agency there are 50 that have failed. There is no tolerance of mediocrity.

And whilst you may not think that agencies serve any purpose other than take money from your precious earnings (though I have never understood how someone can pay out money that is not their in the first place), I challenge you to find a decent sales person let alone pay for one to keep you in work. Also finance people are not easy to find either.

It is thanks to agencies that you guys can do away with a great many overheads involved in running a business, assuming of course that you regard yourselves as businesses which is questionable anyway.

I said I know how you feel Dodgy, it is just that I do not see you in the same light. This is not personal Dodge, I am not suggesting that you are the same as every other agent.
As I have said many times, the world could survive without agents. Clients would still need work doing and contractors would still do the work.
The only reason you exist is due to a certain amount of laziness on our and our clients part and some serious scare mongering in the past on the agencies part.
Of course you are skimming my money. If you were a decent business you would have a set charge for the product you pitch. What is more you work for the client but I end up paying you. Very often you cheat and lie to try to make me accept a lower rate so you can skim more.

[expat]

I will remind you that when it comes to perceptions of "ripping people off" you contractors are up there with bankers, fraudsters and tax collectors (ask any IT permie).
...
It is thanks to agencies that you guys can do away with a great many overheads involved in running a business, assuming of course that you regard yourselves as businesses which is questionable anyway.

ask any IT permie

I don't regard myself as a business (that is a trap which I don't fall into, thank you). I regard myself as an independent knowledge-based professional. As such I have few overheads, and no need for an agent. Of course, end clients may tender via agencies, and in those cases I supply to them. My overheads are pretty much the same anyway.

[DodgyAgent]

I said I know how you feel Dodgy, it is just that I do not see you in the same light. This is not personal Dodge, I am not suggesting that you are the same as every other agent.
As I have said many times, the world could survive without agents. Clients would still need work doing and contractors would still do the work.
The only reason you exist is due to a certain amount of laziness on our and our clients part and some serious scare mongering in the past on the agencies part.
Of course you are skimming my money. If you were a decent business you would have a set charge for the product you pitch. What is more you work for the client but I end up paying you. Very often you cheat and lie to try to make me accept a lower rate so you can skim more.

If the market could do without agents then it would. I wont go in to what value we provide as I dont think that there is enough room on the CUK server . I will say that a lot of people make a lot of money out of other people's fear or lazinesss (sending email instead of delivering a letter by hand 500 miles away falls under this category) and you guys coin most of your money from fear stemming from a lack of understanding, whether it be Y2000 gravy trains or business continuity systems. There is a demand for our services whether you like it or not, and what that demand stems from matters not a jot.

It could also be argued that the world could survive a lot better without IT (which it has) but not without agents. Agents have been in existence for a lot longer than you guys whether in the form of pimping for prostitutes or doing deals on spears, swords and bows and arrows. The integrity of what you do is no greater than what we do.


As for the cheating and lying, I have enough examples of such antics from contractors stored in boxes that wouldnt fit into the Pentagon

[Bagpuss]

Maybe get some hexagonal boxes?

[DodgyAgent]

Maybe get some hexagonal boxes?

[DS23]

Maybe get some hexagonal boxes?

pentagonal shirley?

[snaw]

It is thanks to agencies that you guys can do away with a great many overheads involved in running a business, assuming of course that you regard yourselves as businesses which is questionable anyway.

My missus is now in recruitment, so got nothing against ya per se, and I have no issue with agents making a fair profit for getting me a role.

But, I'm sorry - that quoted paragraph is complete bollocks. You save companies money by doing the recruiting/vetting process for them. But you do absolutely zero for my overheads mate.