Next General Election

[Old Greg]

Unfortunately this widely entrenched view of what Labour and Conservative governments respectively do to the economy is far from true.

The idea that Labour gets into a mess, and the Tories sort it out, has no foundation in reality; and I am looking back over quite a number of governments whan I say that. For example, outgoing chancellor Reginald Maudling had the decency to say to incoming Jim Callaghan, "sorry to leave you such a mess, old cock". I don't think he was talking about the decor in No 11.

I agree with that bit.

Blair's Labour got Brits our highest GDP per head ever, and that higher than the Germans and ther French; Thatcher never did that.

Kind of true, perhaps, but you miss out the bit about how Blair/Brown just presided over a gigantic credit / speculation bubble that resulted in a temporary increase in GDP, and we're in a huge mess now IMO. Can't see how the Tories would have done it any differently, but NL deserve no credit for any GDP increase.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

I agree with that bit.


Kind of true, perhaps, but you miss out the bit about how Blair/Brown just presided over a gigantic credit / speculation bubble that resulted in a temporary increase in GDP, and we're in a huge mess now IMO. Can't see how the Tories would have done it any differently, but NL deserve no credit for any GDP increase.

Careful, this thread's in danger of lurching into a proper debate - you'll upset the usual dogmatic tribal mudslingers with that.

[Dow Jones]

New voters

Joking aside, the biggest change in UK politics is that the Tories have managed this time to atract people from different backgrounds and for various reasons: environment, civil liberties, taxation etc. If they stick with them, most of these guys (inc. some here) will be voting (and not just Tory) for the 1st time in their lives - excellent

[Old Greg]

Careful, this thread's in danger of lurching into a proper debate - you'll upset the usual dogmatic tribal mudslingers with that.

Oi - that was dogmatic tribal mudslinging. I'm just from a different tribe.

[Old Greg]

Joking aside, the biggest change in UK politics is that the Tories have managed this time to atract people from different backgrounds and for various reasons: environment, civil liberties, taxation etc. If they stick with them, most of these guys (inc. some here) will be voting (and not just Tory) for the 1st time in their lives - excellent

The things is (with the Tories) that we'll see what they're like when they get into power. People will get taken in by Dave's matey PR cr@P and be driven there by the implosion of the NL 'project', but I don't buy their newly found love of liberty. I can't forget the whole Pinochet love affair - this all smacks of opportunism to me.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

Oi - that was dogmatic tribal mudslinging. I'm just from a different tribe.

Probably not as different as you think

[Zippy]

If you confuse them with ZANU-PF, I will come up with an air ticket to Harare, and you can proclaim the same views there. A single ticket should do.

Well said.

[VectraMan]

The idea that Labour gets into a mess, and the Tories sort it out, has no foundation in reality; and I am looking back over quite a number of governments whan I say that.

I don't believe that Labour or Conservative makes all that much difference; I think the issue here is one of goverments sticking around too long. We saw that in the 80s and early 90s with the Tories, and we're seeing it now with NL. I'm not sure anything would be all that different under the Tories: we'd still have them taking credit for the boom and claiming that the bust is all outside influences.

NL's theme song was "things can only get better", which was apt and probably true that what the country needed above all else was a change. And now we see history is repeating. Maybe the Tories will make a hash, but at least it will be a different hash.

[expat]

I don't believe that Labour or Conservative makes all that much difference; I think the issue here is one of goverments sticking around too long.

Sad but true. Sad, and damning.

[expat]

...you miss out the bit about how Blair/Brown just presided over a gigantic credit / speculation bubble that resulted in a temporary increase in GDP, and we're in a huge mess now IMO.

Fair enough, in fact "presided" rather flatters their role.

But I really meant early in the Blair/Brown years, they did fix the economy. At a terrible cost to public services, of course. Which leaves the question, why exactly is Blair in the Labour party?