Congestion Charging

[hattra]

Re: Why don't they just increase the fuel tax.

If they get this in place, the next requirement will be for you to pre-pay your congestion charge, otherwise you get a hefty fine, then one day, they stop accepting your card ...........

[IR35 Avoider]

Re: Why don't they just increase the fuel tax.

Oh dear, so if it was an increase in fuel tax it would be too expensive, but if they invent a new tax it is not too much?

Yes.

My point (not sure if you understood it) was that an increase in fuel tax would have to raise several times as much as the new congestion charge to achieve the same effect.

I do believe congestion charging is the only thing the government can do to significantly mitigate the nightmare that is travel within Britain. If you think there isn't a problem that may be where we disagree.

[threaded]

Re: Why don't they just increase the fuel tax.

IR35 Avoider: But how is this new tax supposed to be better at controlling congestion than increasing fuel duty?

You are not under the delusion that the 2p a mile for rural roads will be at any time except very early on a deep winter Sunday morning somewhere in a valley only discovered by global imaging?

[DodgyAgent]

The problem with fuel tax

Is that it is too simple and does not create extra work for cronies. It does not give govt ministers and departments opportunities to build empires. It also makes it very difficult for NL to reward companies like Capita for their directors "gifts" to the labour party.

And govt will have to find another excuse for implementing big brother boxes into our cars (which it surely will)

[SupremeSpod]

Re: The problem with fuel tax

And govt will have to find another excuse for implementing big brother boxes into our cars (which it surely will)

The "War on Driving"!!!!

BTW Dodgy, I've noticed you've got a bit of a bee in your bonnet regarding crapita.... Care to enlighten us?

[DodgyAgent]

Re: The problem with fuel tax

I've noticed you've got a bit of a bee in your bonnet regarding crapita.... Care to enlighten us

They seem to be flavour of the month for govt contracts spod. I am afraid that there is nothing more to it.

[IR35 Avoider]

Re: The problem with fuel tax

But how is this new tax supposed to be better at controlling congestion than increasing fuel duty?

Well, on the fraction of 1% of roads where the congestion charge is currently envisioned to be £1.34 per mile, the congestion charge will make travel several times as expensive as the highest possible fuel charge you could practically implement. (We have already reached the politically practical upper limit for fuel charges.) As I said in another post, even if you could raise fuel tax to charge this much per mile, the result would be to make motoring 10 times more expensive on all other roads as well, causing enormous damage to the economy. On the other roads the fuel tax would be many times higher than needed to control congestion.

The point of congestion charge is that the rate can change according to location (every few metres along the same stretch of road in the unlikely event you need to be that precise) and the rate at a particular point can vary with the time of day. Fuel tax can't do that.

A congestion charge should be set just high enough to lower traffic levels so that traffic maintains a reasonable speed. It can be fine-tuned and altered from day-to-day and hour to hour across the whole country. For example, I imagine it will shoot up on bank holidays on roads leading to the coast.

[AtW]

solution

They should have just charged money for known top 1% roads known for fact to be congested, all other roads are free -- if it aint fecking congested then dont charge.

[MisterGoof]

Re: solution

I that makes some sense AtW, except that the problem will just migrate to the lesser roads as people get off the major roads 1 or 2 junctions early.

[DimPrawn]

Re: solution

House prices.

If congestions charging comes in, think how much more houses that are close to decent rail networks will be?

Why pay hundreds of pounds a week to drive into major towns and cities when you can jump on the train right next door to where you live?

Or will the train operators massively increase train fares? They wouldn't, would they? :\