Helpful Advice

[Denny]

I am afraid that I dont play golf, who are the PGC?

The trade association I call the 'Professional Gangers-up on Contractors.'

[Forumbore]

The trade association I call the 'Professional Gangers-up on Contractors.'

Another of your facts?

[Denny]

Another of your facts?

No - it was just a joke!

[Forumbore]

I think you take the 'roll over an die' attitude which I find so reprehensible to contractors who are making it difficult for contractors who are constantly being squeezed of any sayso or power in the negotiations and are constantly taking a disporportionate share of the risks when using recruiters or working on end-client sites. When I use the word 'favour' I'm not claiming superiority as an individual or using the word on other contractors' behalf. What I am actually doing is pointing out the contractual arrangements that exist between employment businesses and recruiters before and during the time a contractor is placed. The end-client hires the services of the employment business to source candidates, it's not contractors who source the recruiters to find work. In other words - they need us officially, we do not need them officially even if we do desire a business opportunity for ourselves as part of the package. As for your point about being professional on site - when did my attitude over all of this ever suggest that we shouldn't put 110 per cent into doing a good job?

What I have stated above about the contractual arrangements between end-client and recuriter is a fact. It is not an opinion and it's about time contractors realised they are not passive commodities willing to be pushed around by signing up to all manner of terms and negotiations that clearly don't represent our interests as well as serving the needs of of the other parties concerned. That's what the PGC have done to us too by being in the pockets of recruiter interests over opting out and now the hideous idea that we should pay for our own security checks (which I suspect will also go against contractors eventually, should the scheme get a foothold in the market, when recruiters make it a mandatory condition for representing us to certain organisations even if they're not saying so as yet).

I suspect that you are a recruiter. Either that, or you've been brainwashed by right wing attitudes that actually believes and supports the abuse of the 'little person' in business or employees if we're talking about permies.

I am not a recruiter though I do occasionally interview people for jobs. I am currently between contracts, and am off on hols next week. I shall begin looking for work when I return.

What bothers me is that you seem to assume that we contractors are victims. You have a negative attitude about frankly anything that you clearly find threatening; agencies, and clients are painted by you as being some sort of malign force against who a war should be waged. Leaving agencies aside (as it is actually a good sport to ridicule them) you seem to have little appreciation of the fact that the customer pays your and my not inconsiderable wages. I hardly think that we contractors are as helpless as you make out. I for one do not suffer from your inferiority complex. As far as I am concerned if I get my money, paid on time clients and agencies are free to regard me as whatever they want whether it is as if I am a Black Lesbian aids victim with one leg or as a component on a production line that produces bog paper.
As far as I am concerned I have no point to prove about whether I opt in or opt out (I pay an accountant to tell me what to do), and sometimes I need to be a little "persuasive" at the contract negotiation stage, and sometimes I do not. All in all I enjoy (most of) my work, above average earnings and not having to sign a warranty for the work that I do.

What's your problem Denny?

[Daywalker]

[Denny]

I am not a recruiter though I do occasionally interview people for jobs. I am currently between contracts, and am off on hols next week. I shall begin looking for work when I return.

Leaving agencies aside (as it is actually a good sport to ridicule them) you seem to have little appreciation of the fact that the customer pays your and my not inconsiderable wages. I hardly think that we contractors are as helpless as you make out. I for one do not suffer from your inferiority complex. As far as I am concerned if I get my money, paid on time clients and agencies are free to regard me as whatever they want whether it is as if I am a Black Lesbian aids victim with one leg or as a component on a production line that produces bog paper.
As far as I am concerned I have no point to prove about whether I opt in or opt out (I pay an accountant to tell me what to do), and sometimes I need to be a little "persuasive" at the contract negotiation stage, and sometimes I do not. All in all I enjoy (most of) my work, above average earnings and not having to sign a warranty for the work that I do.

What's your problem Denny?

What bothers me is that you seem to assume that we contractors are victims. You have a negative attitude about frankly anything that you clearly find threatening; agencies, and clients are painted by you as being some sort of malign force against who a war should be waged.

Clearly some contractors are 'victims' when they are ripped off by recruiters and end-clients and agencies go bust taking our money with them. Am I imagining things when I read contractors posts outlining testimony after testimony of their experiences asking for advice as to overcome these abuses? No. What's the point in being 'well paid' as you put it when most of my advice is geared toward contractors making money and not losing it unnecessarily? If they followed your advice or adopted your 'roll over and die' attitude contractors using recruiters would never be paid anything.

That's why your assumptions about me as well as your advice to ignore what I say because I have a bad attitude, is absolute piffle.

If you really want to know, I am completely against contractors who are happy to stab recruiters in the back and go direct to the end client when they clearly didn't introduce themselves to that client. I may be against the recruitment agency model, and for good reason, as we should all be if we have any sense, but I'm not into behaving as badly as some cowboy recruiters do either.

[Denny]

It would be much wiser to be a 'fighter not a lurker'. If you are a contractor, (which I doubt) may I suggest you read more useful advice rather than support the ignorant on here?

[Daywalker]

Yeah well maybe you "should try harder"!

Why name yourself after a Bacon anyway?

[Denny]

Yeah well maybe you "should try harder"!

Why name yourself after a Bacon anyway?

I am trying harder (to inform contractors) but my efforts are clearly falling on deaf ears with ignoramuses like you.

[Denny]

Yeah well maybe you "should try harder"!

Why name yourself after a Bacon anyway?

What's a daywalker?