New contract discussion and NDA (non-disclosure agreement)!!!

[Darren_Test]

No time spent on the proposal without being paid.

I don't sign NDAs up front either.

Piss takers.

Ok...NDA was for not to disclose discussions we had to any third party..

[Darren_Test]

If they pay you up front for your work in drawing up the proposal, then no problem with the NDA. If they want you to work for free, explain that you are not a charity.

New contacts may be helpful in the future..??

[Darren_Test]

Sounds like when some clients get you in for an interview to pick your brains and maybe require working examples to a problem they just happen to have, without any intention of progressing to offering a paid contract. Get enough mugs in for 'interviews' and they get the job done for free.

I'd want to know how much time up front they expect for free and if it's significantly more than a typical interview length tell them to do one.

I might be spending 5 hours max including 2 hours I spend already...not that massive work.

[Darren_Test]

Agree with the others in here, sound like a bunch of chancers. They'll get your expertise to win the contract then get some Indians to do the hard graft for pennies.

Looks like there guys are bunch of 'serial inventors'!!!....But all the 7/8 companies started so far all closed down!!!

[Darren_Test]

To offer an alternative perspective, NDAs are fine, routine even if you're working on something that's worth protecting. Also, the idea that you always get paid for work done is ludicrous if you're in business on your own account. Over the years, I've spent thousands on bids won and lost, many of those requiring NDAs.).

My thoughts were on similar lines..

[QUOTE=That being said, I would be wary in the situation described by the OP. I would only ever do this with companies (or owners) that I know from previous work, not "cold callers" (unless they came with a reputation or recommendation).[/QUOTE]

Ok fair point!! - not a bunch I have known before though looks like been in the industry for long time.

[Darren_Test]

Nope for the first.

They should give you a generic clue on what the project/business is about first.

I've signed NDAs but only after I've had an idea of the business area and the firm has offered me a contract.

There is no point in signing an NDA if you don't have an idea on the business area as it could be the same product as what an existing company will bring to market.

I've met people involved in start ups, Both means existing companies can expand into their market area, and if you subsequently decide to provide services for one of those companies in the worse case if the embittered broke directors find out the could come after and while a minority have had good ideas the majority of them aren't niche and where the majority fail is on the fact the directors don't market the idea sufficiently.

you.

Ok. so you signed NDA after getting a contract only..??

Their business is my 'expertise' area!!

[Darren_Test]

There is an easy way to spot most of those assholes. When the agent tells you that it's a small startup, just two guys... but they offer a very high rate you know they are just interviewing contractors to learn for free. They will be asking practical questions, e.g. "so, in terms of scalability... which solutions would you recommend and why?" and if they invite you for an interview they will give you an NDA to sign for the privilege if being interviewed by them.

no agency involved...no offer so far!!

[SueEllen]

Ok. so you signed NDA after getting a contract only..??

Their business is my 'expertise' area!!

Yep.

Most ideas aren't niche. The detail is the niche part.

[Darren_Test]

Absolutely this.

Tell them you'll be invoicing them separately for your time up front but will deduct this amount from your first "regular" invoice if they take you on afterwards.

If they seriously think their idea is going to work and aren't just trying to get some free work out of you, they should be fine with that.

Hoping this will lead to something!!

[Hobosapien]

Sounds like you want to do it so thanks for, at worst, sacrificing a few hours of your time to later give us feedback on how it went, to help anyone in a similar position in future.