Sympathy for the Devil

[phileds]

Don’t wish to get up hopes but actually this may be ok dependent on details. I’m out at min recovering from 5 a side. Pm me your number and can have a chat in morning (all advice on this matter free of charge as only a call)

Hi Phil - I PM'd you.

[BrownOwl]

My update on all of the settlement position is that I now believe settlement to be final and I hold no concerns about HMRC attempting later charges. Clearly other advisors may think different and I'm not wishing to turn it into an argument at all (and I'm sure neither do they) but I'm highly confident the legislation covers it well.
I appreciate that basically stating "I believe hmrc" is as a general rule a bit crazy given the past few years but its based onmy interpretation of the legislation and the conversations ive held with them the past few days.

Hi Phil,

Thanks for the information.

Was there anything in the discussions about a full refund of the settlement if a scheme wins in court or the 2019 legislation is defeated in some way?

[phil@pmtc]

My update on all of the settlement position is that I now believe settlement to be final and I hold no concerns about HMRC attempting later charges. Clearly other advisors may think different and I'm not wishing to turn it into an argument at all (and I'm sure neither do they) but I'm highly confident the legislation covers it well.
I appreciate that basically stating "I believe hmrc" is as a general rule a bit crazy given the past few years but its based onmy interpretation of the legislation and the conversations ive held with them the past few days.

[webberg]

I am confused. I thought that the whole point of BIG GROUP was to negotiate a settlement and that having more participants was part of having weight to achieve that? Please explain.

What's to explain?

Big Group is aimed at settlement and numbers matter.

The above discussion is about CLSO 2.

[Clairol]

I would say almost none.

HMRC is offering an extra statutory position and any attempt to move away from that usually results in a "take it or leave it" scenario.

Phil's note above is fine so far as tax goes but you also have to deal with the loan, DR charge, possible trust distributions etc. I'm sure he can do all of that but you would be sensible to get a fee quote for all the work required to make as clean an exit as you can.

I am confused. I thought that the whole point of BIG GROUP was to negotiate a settlement and that having more participants was part of having weight to achieve that? Please explain.

[phil@pmtc]

Thanks for that I can see in the Liquidators statement that £26K was allowed for HMRC in the solvency declaration but HMRC have asked for £33M yes million - it is being disputed......

Eeesh! 26k-33m That's some difference of opinion! Hope all works out as well as possible.

[Delendog]

HMRC would go after the company for PAYE, employee's NIC and employer's NIC in the first instance. Then they would go after the individual. This is what they said in December.

I don't do insolvency stuff, but if the liquidator couldn't pay HMRC then the MVL would become a CVL. In that case, the directors might get into a bit of trouble with the statutory declaration that they made (that the company will be able to pay all its debts within a year) you would want to get very clear legal advice (not tax advice and not stuff written on a forum) before signing the statutory declaration and listing the assets/liabilities. Why take legal advice? Because "a bit of trouble" could mean a prison sentence or fine.

Thanks for that I can see in the Liquidators statement that £26K was allowed for HMRC in the solvency declaration but HMRC have asked for £33M yes million - it is being disputed......

[Iliketax]

A question for the experts on here if I may.

If your previous employer has filed for Members Voluntary Liquidation but before that has completed HMRC have made a claim on the Company - what status is that Company in regarding the Loan Charge - do HMRC consider it still active and liable or not?

Thanks

HMRC would go after the company for PAYE, employee's NIC and employer's NIC in the first instance. Then they would go after the individual. This is what they said in December.

I don't do insolvency stuff, but if the liquidator couldn't pay HMRC then the MVL would become a CVL. In that case, the directors might get into a bit of trouble with the statutory declaration that they made (that the company will be able to pay all its debts within a year) you would want to get very clear legal advice (not tax advice and not stuff written on a forum) before signing the statutory declaration and listing the assets/liabilities. Why take legal advice? Because "a bit of trouble" could mean a prison sentence or fine.

[Delendog]

Liquidation

A question for the experts on here if I may.

If your previous employer has filed for Members Voluntary Liquidation but before that has completed HMRC have made a claim on the Company - what status is that Company in regarding the Loan Charge - do HMRC consider it still active and liable or not?

Thanks

[Iliketax]

A registered pension scheme - could that be one that my permie employer paid into 15 years ago but since then I haven't paid into? (it has around £40k invested in funds)

Yes

So on £130k I guess the relief would be 45% if one falls into the highest tax rate?

Yes