My first bad experience as a contractor - Investment Banking - Ho Hum *LONG POST*

[chris79]

If you ask me, this guy wasn't randomly asking you questions for the sake of it - he has a mental note now that you are 'questionable'.. be prepared for phase 2 when he will try a similar stunt in the near future..

Be careful going head to head with him, if you show him up you're out.. you need to make sure you are indispensable in some way, get that report done for him and take it to him personally - make sure that when you give it to him you ask for feedback on it and if anything needs to be improved upon it he must let you know.

Also slip in to the convo that you've been learning the business units as he suggested, it shows you've taken his words on board.

These type of characters are trigger happy and taking out the weak is their way of demonstrating to those under him who holds the power.. at the end of the day the situation may be unfavorable, but hey, who cares you're getting paid £££ for smiling through it.

Socially engineer that c**k to ensure your pay day remains intact.

[kanulondon]

Sorry, but you deserve all you get. I've contracted in IB - and finance in general - for over 10 years, and what you are experiencing is pretty much par for the course. You need to learn to fight back. And pronto.

Here's an example (and it's an honest and true account):

1. I went to interview with UK-based German IB. First interview is with PM. Nice chap. All goes well.
2. Go back for second interview with IT director. Decides to leave his door open so all the people in the office can hear him interviewing me LOUDLY. The office wall is glass, so all his employees can see him, and he can keep his beady eyes on them - constantly.
3. Tells me - LOUDLY - that he "Doesn't like people who make mistakes." And "What would I do if I made a mistake and he came out shouting and screaming across the office at me about it?"
4. I reply - VERY, VERY LOUDLY so the entire office turns round to hear: "Well, if the mistake was genuinely my fault, I'd apologise and fix it. However... If the mistake was NOT my fault, I would shout and scream at you and give you such a bollocking that they'd hear it the other side of London! So, you'd best be clear about where the mistake lies before ever tackling me in that manner!"
5. Mr Big Gob decides to continue the rest of the interview very quietly from this point onwards.

And guess what? They came back the following day and offered the job. I turned it down as I'd had an offer from another IB (which I took.) That still didn't stop them coming back with a 5% and then 10% increase in rate if I'd take the job. Still, I wasn't interested.

In other words: deal with these cowards directly. If you don't fight fire-with-fire, you aren't going to last long in IB. And ask yourself: How do you feel now? Seems like you feel a bit of a "winker" for having let this guy get away with it. So, the question is, are you going to spend the rest of your life feeling like that or do something about it?

Sorry if I sound harsh, but that's the reality of the situation. If you let people treat you that way, they will. Me? I don't.

Nomadd

Interesting story Nomadd and appreciate your view point. I am certainly not going to go on like this for the rest of my life but it's not often I am directly challenged by a 3rd level manager (I think they have too many managers btw)

Next time I'll be better prepared

KL

[EddieNambulous]

Interesting story Nomadd and appreciate your view point. I am certainly not going to go on like this for the rest of my life but it's not often I am directly challenged by a 3rd level manager (I think they have too many managers btw)

Next time I'll be better prepared

KL

I think the correct choice in situations like these is about being congruent with who you are. What seems to work for Nomadd may not necessarily work for you unless your personality has a tendency to be a similar "fight back" one.

I've not worked in IB but I have been in situations where you have to deal with abrasive, mocking characters on contracts.

I tend to be much more laid back. My approach is generally to smile sweetly as required and mentally count in my head just how much more I am getting paid than this worthless permie, which tends to make me smile even more. And it helps considerably to remember that you'll be moving on eventually while this other person probably has to suck his own boss's b*lls for the rest of his career.

I find that if abrasive characters don't get the reaction they wanted, they usually get bored and move on anyway.

But as I said, I think it's more about congruence with your own personality than necessarily a particular way of behaving in these situations.

[kanulondon]

Cheers Chris and Eddie.

Good points raised. I must admit whatever happens here, it's certainly good experience and I'm glad I've had experience of dealing earlier on. As I never had such experience in my permie career...

I definitely feel that whole 'just get your timesheets' signed vibe.

I guess the inner peace comes with the understanding that I am above this and not necessarily falling into this guys games...

Will definitely be uber keen when it comes to report time and will smarm my way back into favour with any luck they'll implement a couple of my suggestions..

Keep up the good responses..

Thanks

[BlasterBates]

you're quite right best way not to rise to the bait, and don't get angry; I find complete b*stards easy to deal with, it's the "inbetweens" that are difficult, the ones that are nice as pie one minute and blowing their top the next.

[max]

I am certainly not going to go on like this for the rest of my life but it's not often I am directly challenged by a 3rd level manager (I think they have too many managers btw)

Next time I'll be better prepared

KL

Try telling them your views on their management structure, that should show them who the boss is.

[contractor79]

3. Tells me - LOUDLY - that he "Doesn't like people who make mistakes." And "What would I do if I made a mistake and he came out shouting and screaming across the office at me about it?"
4. I reply -

I'd remind him that we are sinful fallen human beings and that therefore we are not perfect and make mistakes from time to time. And that banks are the last people that should point fingers given the complete and utter mess they have made of everything lately.

I'd also suggest that people should take the plank out of their own eye before pointing out the speck in other people's eyes.

[contractor79]

you're quite right best way not to rise to the bait, and don't get angry; I find complete b*stards easy to deal with, it's the "inbetweens" that are difficult, the ones that are nice as pie one minute and blowing their top the next.

they need to calm down and get a life, frankly

their stress is going to give them an earlier grave

[Stan.goodvibes]

I tend to be much more laid back. My approach is generally to smile sweetly as required and mentally count in my head just how much more I am getting paid than this worthless permie, which tends to make me smile even more. And it helps considerably to remember that you'll be moving on eventually while this other person probably has to suck his own boss's b*lls for the rest of his career.

WHS. Once you get past the initial surprise or even shock at being confronted by a Permie, if you can, just let it ride over you. My biggest problem is trying to keep the smirk off my face. When it's over, think nice thoughts for a moment or two, forget all about the incident, and then just carry on as you were.

After 15 years at this I have developed a good coating of Loser Teflon. Just keep your head down, always look like you are doing *something* even if it's a waste of time, and blend into the background. Office Twats just slide off your loser teflon like you aren't even there.

Note that no matter how little I have to do, I NEVER use the internet at clientco until I have convinced everyone I'm a really hard worker, only then do I start to slack off...

[SantaClaus]

I can relate to most things that have been said here about working in IB.

On my first IB contract, 14 years ago, the boss used to stand behind me while I coded, he also used to go looking for anyone that spent more than 2 mins in the toilet. Oh yes, and he had a very bad "wind" problem that used to put me off my lunch . But I put up with it for what was a lot of money in those days. He had a side-kick who used to throw tantrums like a spoilt kid.

The worst thing is when you're on a long-term contract, everyone in the team gets on and then a psycho manager comes in who's job it is to make "cost savings". Happened to me at a certain bank. The idiot suggested we have "satellite" offices around the M25 to cut costs. He then brought in a bunch of Russians from a consultancy who couldnt code if their lives depended on it. Then he had a bright idea that every minute change had to go through a procedure with wads of documentation. His catchphrase was "be professional" and some people may recognise him from that.

Funny thing was, he was brought in before my old boss was given the chop and sat at his desk quietly until that day. Once old boss was gone, Dr Jekyll quickly became Mr Hyde.

Then theres some great moments when you are told that youre "not performing", when in-fact there is no work do be done or you have been sidelined onto a boring legacy support project.

And of course, working long hours and weekends is mandatory, even if there is nothing to do. Impressions (and not quality of work) count.

Arrogant and bullying behaviour is par for the course in IB. Just keep your head down, accept the work that the permies dont want to do and earn the big bucks whilst you can. At the same time, plan for the day when you have enough money to do something else and that inevitable black bin-liner lands on your desk or you are dismissed by text message/fax/agency call.