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**Troll** · 13 October 2006, 21:04

S*it happens...I think you do need to get back into a permie position though

**VectraMan** · 13 October 2006, 21:42

Permie or contract, I tend to assume that if they want you they're going to tell you within a day or two at most.

Three days later I get a call from the HR department and they say that there are a few more details that need to be processed before an offer can be made, although they stress it is a formality.

That's the point you should have realised. Easy to say with hindsight I know, but you had another job lined up, you didn't need this one that badly. I think I would have refused to jump through any more hoops and ask them if they were going to renege on their offer.

**cojak** · 14 October 2006, 08:13

2 things here really.

1) A verbal contract isn't worth the paper it's written on. Unless you are already 'resting' (and I wouldn't do it then) DO NOTHING until you have the contract for the new gig in your hands. Don't say anything to you existing client, don't book accommodation, flights. DO NOTHING. Trust no one and be particularly suspicious of those who say 'it's only a formality'. Remember - you do not have a contract until you have the contract. Simple really.

2) Swallow your embarassment/pride! You're a contractor goddamit, not a permie! Pride doesn't come into it. (This is the point Troll was making...)

PS) Oh and 3) Punitive damages?? Oh, get real... Go back to 2) - they'll just laugh at you. Just tell people who the company was, that way you get your revenge and help others at the same time...

**bobhope** · 16 October 2006, 06:55

Just chalk it up to experience. In a way, I feel sorry for those people who have never been done over by a company. It's just a matter of time before they. Therefore, it's better to learn the lesson as early as possible. So, although I didn't enjoy it at the time, being screwed over on my first job was a good thing :-)

**Denny** · 16 October 2006, 08:20

Originally posted by ratsbot

I thought this might be worth sharing although it is not contracting per se.

I am currently on contract with a good client and who was keen to extend for a further 6 months. Meanwhile I get contacted for an "excellent" permie job. I have a phone interview and meet with the hiring director. A week later I get a verbal offer and a negotiation takes place on salary and bonus. We agree on everything and I am told that the paperwork will be sent out to me ASAP.

In the meantime I send the hiring director an email to say thanks and I'm looking forward to starting. He emails back and says well done, he is keen to see me start. Then we have a phone conversation and he asks me to make room in my diary to do a presentation at his team meeting to introduce myself etc. All good and dandy.

In the meantime, my contract is up for renewal. Do I keep quiet or advise my client of what is an excellent career move for me. As I have an excellent working relationship with my client and given that I was told the paperwork will follow in the next couple of days, i decide to speak to my client!

Three days later I get a call from the HR department and they say that there are a few more details that need to be processed before an offer can be made, although they stress it is a formality. So I take the tests and pass. I also get interviewed by another manager. This last interview was done via telephone. At the end of the call he tells me that he will recommend to proceed with hiring. All of this has now taken a further 4 weeks from the original verbal offer.

I wait a further week and decide I now need an answer. So I push HR for a decision. At this point I get an answer that simply stuns me. HR tell me that they have offered the job to another candidate. The organisation I am talking about is in the FTSE 100.

I am thoroughly p#ssed off that they could behave in this way. I am pretty sure that the reason this has all happened is because the hiring director agreed a salary without consulting HR. In the meantime, I have spoken to my contract client and advised that it's all a formality and suddenly all of this stuff surfaces. I was so embarrassed that I actually decided to move to another client even though they were keen to see me stay. But i am fuming at the way this company behaved.

Has anyone ever been faced with something similar? Did you take the offending company to task for punitive damages so they don't repeat it to others.

Thanks for reading!!

I expect that this company has a policy in place to first consider internal candidates looking to move within the organisation and only use outsiders if none become available. This happens a lot in large corporations and it's only fair really when so many who already work hard within an organisation and do well get passed over for promotion because someone from outside comes in over their head. How would you feel if that happened to you if, say after a couple of years of being there, you were potentially passed over for promotion? Lousy I expect. I suspect that HR caught wind that the hiring procedure hadn't been carried out properly and took steps to remedy this, by putting the job out on the internal job boards, but keeping you dangling in the meantime, in case other candidates turned out to be unsuitable. It looks like someone was suitable and that's why the story ended the way it did.

The only thing that was wrong is that your expectations were managed badly and because HR didn't tell you that they had other stages to complete first. This made you still believe the job was yours. The fault really lies with your hiring Director not HR for not clearing the process with HR in the first place. As others say above, the job is not yours until you get written confirmation. You never got this and so you were let down.

I am also contracting for a large corporation and the same thing happened to me - except with a happy ending in my case. Went for interview, got offer, set up references that were mysteriously not taken up for a week or two. Then the EB got back to me to tell me that they had to go through due process and advertise my role internally, which had not yet been done. Luckily for me, neither candidate was suitable so I got the role anyway.

The rule of thumb is this, if you think you've got the role, or actually get offered it verbally, never assume that you will actually start and always be suspicious if the offer takes more time than you think should be the case. If that happens, keep renewing, keep looking, keep attending interviews. Never break ties with your current client until the papers are signed.

**Mailman** · 16 October 2006, 09:38

I had the same thing happen with HSBC, attended 4 interviews met lots of people but at the end of the day the position was taken by an internal person who was getting moved sideways because he was sh1t at his current job!

Gutted...but life moves on.

Mailman

**Denny** · 16 October 2006, 19:47

Originally posted by Mailman

but at the end of the day the position was taken by an internal person who was getting moved sideways because he was sh1t at his current job!

Mailman

But better than you are at your job.

**lukemg** · 17 October 2006, 08:48

Easy to fall for this one, contract or permie. If the co is showing some interest (but may be saying we have to look at some others)The agent often says you are in to try and keep you on the hook, nightmare for them is the co finally says yes they want you and you have sorted something else out. I would have stated deadline for when the contract is up i.e. if you don't have it sorted by then, it will be another 3 months before I am available (presuming no notice clause). If you then get the job offer after renewing, I would talk to the co I am at, say look I have been offered a permie job, that I would really like to take but don't want to leave you in the sh1t, how about I stay a month, tie up loose ends, help you find a replacement (everyone is replaceable). Most places would be fine with that, in reality they have no choice, if they demand you stay, they can't think you will give 100%, it is just human nature.
Chalk it up and try to forget about it, always look after no1 because you can bet everyone else in the process will be doing that.

**barely_pointless** · 17 October 2006, 23:54

happened to everyone at least once, A certain Senior Director finds that they are very happy with you and decides to try and bring you on board, you like the idea, the package is great, you chat, and then HR get involved, 5 weeks later they then sit you infront of a very hungry junior manager who reports to aforementioned director.............

game over...........

Remember that permies don't just want to succeed in themselves alone, everyone else must also fail.

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