To the foaming mad Brexiters crying foul that democracy has been thwarted...

[scooterscot]

perhaps you should understand what it meant in the first place, for the average man / woman in the street. A statement from Scottish economist Alexander Tytler, who in 1787, was reported to have commented on the then-new American Republic as follows:

A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been about 200 years.

[Old Greg]

Nurse!

[Bean]

perhaps you should understand what it meant in the first place, for the average man / woman in the street. A statement from Scottish economist Alexander Tytler, who in 1787, was reported to have commented on the then-new American Republic as follows:

A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been about 200 years.

That quote seems to suggest that, the only way to 'save' democracies - is to scale back the welfare spending, i.e. Austerity ?

Well, that was unexpected. Thanks for that scooter

[scooterscot]

If you digested the message.... MP's selling votes for fiscal promises is the way to break democracy. Big number on a bus jog your memory?

That's the point, when you replace facts with fiscal promises you bankrupt the public purse. The UK is bankrupt, borrowing and borrowing more and more money and yet somehow at 90% GDP many still believe the country is rich. Amazing when you think about it really.

[original PM]

Nah I read it like Bean.

The post supports the notion that socialism simply does not work and it fails when you have to start spending your own money rather than someone else's.

[Lance]

I read it as democracy doesn't work. That's why we don't have real democracy. We have representative democracy, with career politicians, who's self interest means they avoid doing stupid things like bankrupting the economy for a few cheap votes.

Which was all fine until some plank decided to have a referendum he thought was in the bag. Resulting in the thick half of the population being bought as per Scooter's original suggestion.
Corbyn is the same thing.
That's why he likes Brexit. It's part of the same perverted sickness, and parcity of intellect, that made him a plausible opposition leader.

[original PM]

I read it as democracy doesn't work. That's why we don't have real democracy. We have representative democracy, with career politicians, who's self interest means they avoid doing stupid things like bankrupting the economy for a few cheap votes.

Which was all fine until some plank decided to have a referendum he thought was in the bag. Resulting in the thick half of the population being bought as per Scooter's original suggestion.
Corbyn is the same thing.
That's why he likes Brexit. It's part of the same perverted sickness, and parcity of intellect, that made him a plausible opposition leader.

So Democracy does not work and just exists to line the pockets of the career politicians.

The EU apparently was/is a democracy.

The stupid majority in the UK voted out of a large democratic body (which as you say does not work) so we can concentrate on our small democratic body and making it work.

Does that sum it up?

[GreenMirror]

The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been about 200 years.

When did the UK start being civilized?

[Bean]

If you digested the message.... MP's selling votes for fiscal promises is the way to break democracy. Big number on a bus jog your memory?

That's the point, when you replace facts with fiscal promises you bankrupt the public purse. The UK is bankrupt, borrowing and borrowing more and more money and yet somehow at 90% GDP many still believe the country is rich. Amazing when you think about it really.

Those words I've highlighted above - what do you think is the antidote to that;

1. more spending/borrowing,
2. the same or
3. less?

Shall we break out the credit card, belt tightening analogy again?

[WTFH]

Think of the money we'll save without needing a specific plane for Boris.

Best thing to do is raise the taxes for under 40s and start spending money smartly, and treat pensions as taxable income when they are being claimed.
Politicians should be taxed under full IR35 rules.
Wealth Management Companies (and their ilk) should be taxed on their profits based on the citizenship of their clients.

Do we need a new power station? Yes.
The next question should not be "how much money do we borrow off the Chinese to give to the French to get it built?"