• Visitors can check out the Forum FAQ by clicking this link. You have to register before you can post: click the REGISTER link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. View our Forum Privacy Policy.
  • Want to receive the latest contracting news and advice straight to your inbox? Sign up to the ContractorUK newsletter here. Every sign up will also be entered into a draw to WIN £100 Amazon vouchers!

Government to consult on tax avoidance in the private sector

Collapse
X
  •  
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #11
    Public sector rules just mean many contracts are advertised outside. Pick one of those and IR35 goes away. What's not to like?
    Cats are evil.

    Comment


      #12
      I cannot see it being an issue.
      HR departments will just learn an outline set of rules, probably based on SDC, and apply IR35 correctly.

      If you're a permietractor then you'll have to pay the tax you should have in the first place. So what....
      If you're a genuine freelancer without SDC then you'll be the same as now, but with less chance of being investigated.
      See You Next Tuesday

      Comment


        #13
        Screw the Tesco vouchers, this is one for IPSE
        ⭐️ Gold Star Contractor

        Comment


          #14
          Originally posted by Lance View Post
          I cannot see it being an issue.
          HR departments will just learn an outline set of rules, probably based on SDC, and apply IR35 correctly.

          If you're a permietractor then you'll have to pay the tax you should have in the first place. So what....
          If you're a genuine freelancer without SDC then you'll be the same as now, but with less chance of being investigated.
          Right, because CEST is an accurate reflection of IR35 case law and is unlikely to gain much traction among HR/procurement departments that can't be fecked to decide properly

          Comment


            #15
            Originally posted by jamesbrown View Post
            Right, because CEST is an accurate reflection of IR35 case law and is unlikely to gain much traction among HR/procurement departments that can't be fecked to decide properly
            If a private sector client uses the CEST tool it will show them how to make someone outside. A real right of substitution being one easy way. Another being not telling the contractor how to do the work. That makes it easy for the client to determine that a temp filing clerk is almost certainly inside, and a specialist IT consultant telling them how to do a,b,c is definitely outside. Simples.
            See You Next Tuesday

            Comment


              #16
              Originally posted by ChimpMaster View Post
              ... and I'm out. Will close down, MVL and ride off into the sunset.
              +1

              Soon the contractor supply pool will be 90% newbies with neither the experience nor the clue to realise that the old hands have taken their permanent jobs or just retired from the market completely.
              "I can put any old tat in my sig, put quotes around it and attribute to someone of whom I've heard, to make it sound true."
              - Voltaire/Benjamin Franklin/Anne Frank...

              Comment


                #17
                Originally posted by Lance View Post
                If a private sector client uses the CEST tool it will show them how to make someone outside. A real right of substitution being one easy way. Another being not telling the contractor how to do the work. That makes it easy for the client to determine that a temp filing clerk is almost certainly inside, and a specialist IT consultant telling them how to do a,b,c is definitely outside. Simples.
                Hmmm, I wonder where we could look for evidence of this implementation working successfully...

                If your argument is that the private sector will respond very differently and apply this to individual cases and not be overly concerned about compliance risks, I think you might be disappointed, although I concede that it's likely to vary somewhat between sectors and clients.

                Comment


                  #18
                  Originally posted by jamesbrown View Post
                  Hmmm, I wonder where we could look for evidence of this implementation working successfully...

                  If your argument is that the private sector will respond very differently and apply this to individual cases and not be overly concerned about compliance risks, I think you might be disappointed, although I concede that it's likely to vary somewhat between sectors and clients.
                  Absolutely.
                  I'm still not overly concerned. When it rolled onto public sector it wasn't the carnage that was postulated, and it's looking like rolling back as recent legal cases have been err.... problematic shall we say for the PS body and HMRC.
                  See You Next Tuesday

                  Comment


                    #19
                    Originally posted by Lance View Post
                    If a private sector client uses the CEST tool it will show them how to make someone outside. A real right of substitution being one easy way. Another being not telling the contractor how to do the work.
                    But how would HR decide in advance that contractor X should be allowed to substitute or not? Or won't be told what to do?
                    They could ask the hiring manager "are you happy for this contractor to substitute? Do you agree this contractor will not be supervised or controlled?"

                    Maybe it just becomes part of the form filling for the hiring manger to feed HR with what they need to know to determine status.
                    And when their roles get advertised as inside, and no one applies, they'll soon start filling those forms in differently.
                    Last edited by yMyjgT; 18 May 2018, 12:27.

                    Comment


                      #20
                      They'll probably end up with a set of role titles that are blanket in and out:

                      PMO Analyst - in
                      PM - in
                      Technical Specialist - out
                      and so on.

                      They could then go case by case for those that argue the toss because they can't get the candidates.
                      The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he didn't exist

                      Comment

                      Working...
                      X