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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by LondonManc View Post
    Not really; fixed price means that you keep coming in until it's done and you can then calculate what your actual day rate is, e.g. 25,000 was agreed as the price and you get it done as quickly as you can, whereas the other way, you'll bill for 54 days over the 3 months at the pre-agreed rate.
    Yeah but isn't he in no mans land surely. Fixed number of days for a fixed deliverable? It's one or the other hasn't it. Is it fixed price, or is it paid on delivery? It just doesn't sound different enough to be anything more than he's got now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by northernladuk View Post
    Yeah but isn't he in no mans land surely. Fixed number of days for a fixed deliverable? It's one or the other hasn't it. Is it fixed price, or is it paid on delivery? It just doesn't sound different enough to be anything more than he's got now.
    Yep, fixed price is the silver bullet, not fixed number of days. I'm not even sure that the OP suggested a fixed deliverable, rather a service package if you will.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LondonManc View Post
    Yep, fixed price is the silver bullet, not fixed number of days. I'm not even sure that the OP suggested a fixed deliverable, rather a service package if you will.
    Exactly. A lump sum project bid for and won on price, executed against a purchase order. You're home and dry.

    Same role, different "agreement" and a different contract = No silver bullet. Sorry.

  4. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by LondonManc View Post
    Yep, fixed price is the silver bullet, not fixed number of days. I'm not even sure that the OP suggested a fixed deliverable, rather a service package if you will.
    Hmm Yeah. I'd assumed fixed deliverable as that is what he's already doing and expected to do. You can call it a service package but if he's admitted it's the same role then I don't think he can polish it up.

    He says

    but the role and tasks remain unchanged.
    and think that this covers it...

    Same role, different "agreement" and a different contract = No silver bullet. Sorry.
    Whether HMRC can have the wool pulled over their eyes is a different question but it appears to me it will just fall apart under the slightest of scrutiny.

    The only get out here is the OP does say is

    My individual contract and actual working practice is a lot more complex.
    So it could actually be that the new format more suits his delivery better than the old bum on seat one so could work. Devil will be in the details.
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    Quote Originally Posted by northernladuk View Post
    Hmm Yeah. I'd assumed fixed deliverable as that is what he's already doing and expected to do. You can call it a service package but if he's admitted it's the same role then I don't think he can polish it up.

    He says

    and think that this covers it...

    Whether HMRC can have the wool pulled over their eyes is a different question but it appears to me it will just fall apart under the slightest of scrutiny.

    The only get out here is the OP does say is

    So it could actually be that the new format more suits his delivery better than the old bum on seat one so could work. Devil will be in the details.
    The complexity of what though? Unless the OP can prove that he is a special case or he's prepared to risk a fixed price contract with a fixed deliverable, it could well be scrutinised. I'd be pushing back on the client and Pertemps while trying to educate them that not all roles should be inside IR35 rather than getting caught up in the structure of the contract.
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  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by aikidoka View Post
    Hi all, thanks for the responses.

    It would be Outside and potentially they would be invoicing my company directly rather than through the agency.

    They are paying me for a set number of consultancy days to deliver 2 projects that I have already provided estimates for. So, yes... in this case there is a fixed deliverable.

    It just feels a little like one of the reasons IR35 came into being where people were leaving an organisation on the Friday, only to come back on the Monday as a "consultant" in the same job.
    If the >client< is saying it would be outside, fine, ignore any of these guys who didn't bother to read carefully. The client bears the liability, all is well.

    If you've got a new contract, even better. If you've got a direct contract not through the agency, better still. If you've got a direct contract not through the agency, and you are getting paid part of the cut the agency was taking, best of all.

    If the client isn't the one saying it would be outside, if that's just your assessment, forget it.

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