SThree have launched their IR35 product
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  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by eek View Post
    You then also have an agency that knows how things need to work to keep people outside so if things start looking wrong at the end client (scope creep, can just look at) you can be sure S3 will step in and advice the client that they can't do that...
    I'd be interested to see how that can work in practice, unless S3 are going to have someone on the ground in every PS client that they work with who is monitoring the individuals (or certainly those in the project that will oversee the work). How can the agency prevent a project manager on a remote project from asking "can you just look at..."? I just don't see that being possible. I'm not convinced that a contractor can "be sure S3 will step in" at all.

    S3 need to do a good sales job on all the end clients that they should either complete the ESS in a manner that S3 say they should, or that the end client should not use the ESS and should use their Qdos product instead - neither are likely to be an easy sell, but if anyone can sell it to the client it will be an agent.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RonBW View Post
    I'd be interested to see how that can work in practice, unless S3 are going to have someone on the ground in every PS client that they work with who is monitoring the individuals (or certainly those in the project that will oversee the work). How can the agency prevent a project manager on a remote project from asking "can you just look at..."? I just don't see that being possible. I'm not convinced that a contractor can "be sure S3 will step in" at all.

    S3 need to do a good sales job on all the end clients that they should either complete the ESS in a manner that S3 say they should, or that the end client should not use the ESS and should use their Qdos product instead - neither are likely to be an easy sell, but if anyone can sell it to the client it will be an agent.
    That's going to have to be part of the client education process, and will also rely non the contractor pushing back and saying "No, I can't because it's not part of the scope of my contract. Please go and talk to the hiring manager who understands this."


    Of course if they *are* the hiring manager then there is a problem, but reminding them of the arrangements and risks should do the job.
    "Being nice costs nothing and sometimes gets you extra bacon" - Pondlife.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by eek View Post
    Believe me its a surprise. But its the same as with Contractor Umbrella I have the direct dial of senior people and I know they are clueful....
    So you get the clueful to do the needful?
    The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he didn't exist

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    Quote Originally Posted by LondonManc View Post
    So you get the clueful to do the needful?
    and revert with the updating....
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveB View Post
    and revert with the updating....
    updation

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveB View Post
    That's going to have to be part of the client education process, and will also rely non the contractor pushing back and saying "No, I can't because it's not part of the scope of my contract. Please go and talk to the hiring manager who understands this."


    Of course if they *are* the hiring manager then there is a problem, but reminding them of the arrangements and risks should do the job.
    I agree - it hinges on S3 being able to spot the problems in advance and manage that so that they don't get hit with the liability, and clients realising that you aren't just an arsey contractor saying "no" to their reasonable request.

    Which is going to be a very long, drawn out process for S3 and the PSB to work through.
    First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. But Gandhi never had to deal with HMRC

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by RonBW View Post
    I agree - it hinges on S3 being able to spot the problems in advance and manage that so that they don't get hit with the liability, and clients realising that you aren't just an arsey contractor saying "no" to their reasonable request.

    Which is going to be a very long, drawn out process for S3 and the PSB to work through.
    It hinges on S3 providing education to the client and the ability to everyone to push back when someone tries push things and that could be the client, it could equally be the contractor going native to remain in contract...
    merely at clientco for the entertainment

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    Quote Originally Posted by eek View Post
    It hinges on S3 providing education to the client and the ability to everyone to push back when someone tries push things and that could be the client, it could equally be the contractor going native to remain in contract...
    That's going to take a long time to achieve.
    First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. But Gandhi never had to deal with HMRC

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by eek View Post
    It hinges on S3 providing education to the client and the ability to everyone to push back when someone tries push things and that could be the client, it could equally be the contractor going native to remain in contract...
    I suspect there will be contract clauses requiring notification to S3 of any changes in working practices with the penalty for failure being liability for tax and NI arising as a result.
    "Being nice costs nothing and sometimes gets you extra bacon" - Pondlife.

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by northernladuk View Post
    Scheme isn't the best word to use surely?
    Agree

    Quote Originally Posted by teapot418 View Post
    product?
    Better

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