SThree have launched their IR35 product

[eek]

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/compu...F0aviZrg%3D%3D

Main bits of interest are:-

• QDOS review
• Where an ‘Outside IR35’ determination has been provided as a result of Status Review, the liability for mis-classification will be undertaken by S3....

The important bit to emphasis here is that if an agency is making the determination that agency needs to be big enough to stand by the decision and be able to pay the bill if its wrong.

An outside determination from a small (back bedroom agency) isn't really the best offer in the new marketplace.

[northernladuk]

Scheme isn't the best word to use surely?

[Fred Bloggs]

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/compu...F0aviZrg%3D%3D

Main bits of interest are:-

• QDOS review
• Where an ‘Outside IR35’ determination has been provided as a result of Status Review, the liability for mis-classification will be undertaken by S3....

The important bit to emphasis here is that if an agency is making the determination that agency needs to be big enough to stand by the decision and be able to pay the bill if its wrong.

An outside determination from a small (back bedroom agency) isn't really the best offer in the new marketplace.

Goodnight IPSE's business model of selling IR35 insurance then eh? At least for public sector workers. S3's move can only open the flood gates to the other major agencies, I feel. It has the feeling of saying to HMG and HMRC "yah boo sux". Brookson took the same stance (in a very different way) against IR35 with their composite companies and eventually were legislated against with the MSC regs. This is the next phase of the great cat and mouse game with the stakes getting ever higher.

[eek]

Scheme isn't the best word to use surely?

I was going to use solution but for those with a longer memory that phrase is actually worse....

[MrMarkyMark]

I was going to use solution but for those with a longer memory that phrase is actually worse....

As long as you don't prefix it "Sunday" you will be OK

[teapot418]

The client has the choice of using HMRC's tool (which HMRC have said they'll stand by), or S3's QDOS offering, which HMRC could challenge. With both, the client will (presumably) need to confirm their understanding of contract terms and working practices.


Subject to final legislation, liability is already with the payer, so that's no different.

What am I missing? Not wanting to be negative, just to understand

[teapot418]

I was going to use solution but for those with a longer memory that phrase is actually worse....

product?

[BoredBloke]

As long as you don't prefix it "Sunday" you will be OK

Or final

[MrMarkyMark]

Or final

Met a couple just the other Christmas when I was out with my family at one of their friends.

They used to work for Sunday Solutions when it went t*ts up, but then had then gone on to create their own scheme.

They then started to try and sell to me, I made it very clear why I wasn't interested and why.

The best that they could come up with as far as defence to my rhetoric was that the scheme was "QC approved."

[eek]

The client has the choice of using HMRC's tool (which HMRC have said they'll stand by), or S3's QDOS offering, which HMRC could challenge. With both, the client will (presumably) need to confirm their understanding of contract terms and working practices.


Subject to final legislation, liability is already with the payer, so that's no different.

What am I missing? Not wanting to be negative, just to understand

The client has little incentive to generate an outside result with the tool (except when they really cannot find a candidate in which case which decision is HMRC going to use).

S3 are instead guiding the client through the process (probably ensuring they fill in the form correctly in such a way that the answer reads outside). They are also checking that the working practices are outside (given that the contract will be standard - that's all that QDOS needs to do).

You then also have an agency that knows how things need to work to keep people outside so if things start looking wrong at the end client (scope creep, can just look at) you can be sure S3 will step in and advice the client that they can't do that...

Hence (and I'm trying hard not to make this a sales pitch for I'm not on commission) while any initial client may say you are outside there is a risk that the clients behaviour may eventually lead you into being inside. With S3 that's less likely to occur as the agency can advice the client that they can't do that....