Public sector contracting

[DaveB]

I got the request at the beginning of April to submit evidence by the end of April, which I did. I received confirmation from the govt dept last week that they were happy with the evidence provided which was:

• A QDOS contract review
• A Working Practices questionnaire (drawn up by the govt dept) signed my me and my engagement manager.

B

Which is how it should work. It's just another pointless hoop to jump through if you work in the PS. Just fill in the paper work and get on with it.

As I believe I may have mentioned earlier, the whole thing was done out of political expediancy by a complete CockWomble of a minister. The cluster**** is now resolving itself by following the path of least resistance for the Civil Servants who neither know nor care about the reasoning. It's just another form for them to fill in.

[bracken]

Which is how it should work. It's just another pointless hoop to jump through if you work in the PS. Just fill in the paper work and get on with it.

As I believe I may have mentioned earlier, the whole thing was done out of political expediancy by a complete CockWomble of a minister. The cluster**** is now resolving itself by following the path of least resistance for the Civil Servants who neither know nor care about the reasoning. It's just another form for them to fill in.

Indeed and just to give a little bit more info to you all, there were also a handful who failed the working practices questionnaire bit and had their contract duly terminated - mainly around the assignment manager not being prepared to sign off that the Contractor had a ROS.

One thing worked quite well for me - as part of the Working Practices questionnaire, my assignment manager confirmed that I could work in any location without the departments approval so on renewal, I managed to get that changed in the Capita contract (where client approval is usually required suggesting D&C).

[Murder1]

Has anyone working public sector been presented with an extension but then told it has a limited number of working days within it? I'm not sure as yet but from the rumours I'm hearing is that some places are limiting the number of working days in a period using the annual leave calculation = (220/ 365) * calendar days in the period

[m0n1k3r]

Has anyone working public sector been presented with an extension but then told it has a limited number of working days within it? I'm not sure as yet but from the rumours I'm hearing is that some places are limiting the number of working days in a period using the annual leave calculation = (220/ 365) * calendar days in the period

The only Government framework agreement that recruitment agencies can realistically sell to the Government under is the CL1 (Contingent Labour 1) framework that is managed by Capita alone. All others requires the supplier to take some sort of responsibility over what they supply, and that is quite alien to recruiters.

Government agencies generally purchase a set number of days worked, while recruiters (and Capita) always buy a date range from the contractor (e.g. like a temporary employment agreement). E.g. the Government agency might buy 110 days (~6 months), but Capita & the recruitment agency they subcontract to might enter into an agreement that says 1 April to 30 September. If you're getting near the end of that term, they might realise that there is still a number of unused days on the purchase order, and offer you an extension.

What they should instead do is contract with you for the same number of days worked, but they never appear to think that far.

[DaveB]

Just so we keep all the Public Sector related stuff here, 2016 budget changes regarding public Sector work.

Budget 2016 43
Off-payroll engagement in the public sector
1.148 Some individuals who work through their own limited company are undertaking jobs
that would ordinarily mean they are employees of the business that they are working for. In
those circumstances, existing legislation on off-payroll working requires them to pay broadly
the same taxes as employees. However, non-compliance with these rules is costing the taxpayer
around £440 million a year – and these costs are rising.113
1.149 Public sector bodies have a responsibility to taxpayers to ensure that the people working
for them are paying the right tax. From April 2017, where the public sector engages an
off-payroll worker through their own limited company, that body (or the recruiting
agency if the public sector body engages through one) will become responsible
for determining whether the rules should apply, and for paying the right tax. This
strengthens the public sector’s role in ensuring that the workers it engages comply with the
rules.
1.150 The government also recognises that the current rules are seen as complex and can
create uncertainty. It will therefore consult on a simpler set of tests and online tools

So, no immediate changes.

Consultation over the next 12 months around a revised employment status test to be applied by Agencies or Clients.

Following introduction of the tests in 2017, those found to be "employees" will be paid net of income tax and NI, with the rest to be paid to HMRC by the client or agency along with employers NI.

A lot will depend on the exact nature of the tests and the attitude of the Agency and Client. It has the potential to create additional costs for them through employers NI as well as the admin overheads to administer the tests and put people on the payroll.

Edit : More details

https://www.gov.uk/government/upload...FINAL_V3_0.pdf

[sdyson31]

would i be effected by new rules

Hi, I have got 3 months rolling contract in public sector which may last for 12 months. I haven't signed the contract yet, just need to sort few things out.

My contract is through an agency and get paid via agency.

What if my contract last for 12 months or more...would my contract be effected by new laws in april 2017?

[northernladuk]

Hi, I have got 3 months rolling contract in public sector which may last for 12 months. I haven't signed the contract yet, just need to sort few things out.

My contract is through an agency and get paid via agency.

What if my contract last for 12 months or more...would my contract be effected by new laws in april 2017?

I'd guess the first renewal that starts after Apr 2017 would yes. This was answered in the other thread. You have a three month inside IR35 rolling contract, not a 12 month one.

You still going ahead with that car crash then? Very.. Erm... Brave of you.

[Hobosapien]

A lot can change before next year.

Unless there are less risky opportunities (i.e. non-public sector) on the horizon I'd consider the contract as the current rules stand re IR35, and look to move on before any new detrimental rules come into play that may have a retrospective element for contracts already in progress.

Those saying "don't do it you'll be screwed next year" are probably struggling to get a contract and will be asking you for the agent next. They're also probably the same ones that try to predict investments a year in advance and pull out too soon out of fear.

Timing is key. Too soon is just as bad as too late sometimes. Carry on and keep invoicing until the new rules are clarified and appropriate plans can be made.

[DaveB]

A lot can change before next year.

Unless there are less risky opportunities (i.e. non-public sector) on the horizon I'd consider the contract as the current rules stand re IR35, and look to move on before any new detrimental rules come into play that may have a retrospective element for contracts already in progress.

Those saying "don't do it you'll be screwed next year" are probably struggling to get a contract and will be asking you for the agent next. They're also probably the same ones that try to predict investments a year in advance and pull out too soon out of fear.

Timing is key. Too soon is just as bad as too late sometimes. Carry on and keep invoicing until the new rules are clarified and appropriate plans can be made.

+1.

The death of contracting in the Public Sector has been predicted many times. A lot can happen between now and next April so Keep Calm and Carry On Invoicing. For now at least.

[smalldog]

Im in public sector and am getting out of dodge at the next opportunity, i.e. next few months. It just doesn't seem worth it now, the rates are not as good and all I need is the HMRC ESI tool to be heavily biased and Im screwed. Based on their examples I don't have multiple clients and have to bid for works. Even if it goes through consultation and isn't quite so damaging Osborne and his cronnies need a message sending so personally I would like nothing better than to see the PS suffer due to this policy. It might make them finally realize the importance of freelance market and to back off.

There is a prospect of a 2-3 year programme in private sector imminently so gonna consider that when I otherwise wouldn't have. Osborne will screw the PS now, regardless of what happens in the next 12 months, people will run scared if there is a prospect of a long term contract in private. Its no different to the IR35 fear all those years ago.

Couple that with the fact that the Perm pay isn't competitive and in one foul swoop he has jeopardised a whole swathe of PS projects, contractors leaving in droves and cant recruit talent due to poor salaries. Roll on the consultancies rubbing their hands with glee!