What does a PM do?

[original PM]

Or am I being too cynical?

probably!

one of my main task where I am is acting as an intepreter between the developers and the accountants - they both speak different languages!

Personally I always try and get the developers involved in discussions with users and only speak up if things are getting off track - some places unfortunatey seem to try and keep developers locked away in a darkened room working solely from requirement and tech specs.

I guess the fact is if the PM is not so good then yes they will get in the way.

[Bob Dalek]

Originally Posted by Cowboy Bob

Passes the buck to the lead developer when it all gets too technical for him at the end of the project leaving the lead developer to manage the final stages of the project on top of trying to do his own work.

You forgot "Also cleverly uses various techniques to, early on, plant the germ of doubt in the minds of the Upper Crust about the abilities of the Developers and DBAs, before his/her own ineptitude leads to overspend and overrunning, thus covering his/her worthless, amateurish arse, only to be put in charge of another eventual mess."

[PM-Junkie]

OK, so everything that ever goes wrong on a project is entirely the fault of the PM, all of whom are incompetent idiots who bring no value at all to an organisation.

Glad we got that settled then.

Reading some of these contributions, the phrase "bitter and twisted" kinda pops in there...

[Bob Dalek]

Originally Posted by PM-Junkie

OK, so everything that ever goes wrong on a project is entirely the fault of the PM, all of whom are incompetent idiots who bring no value at all to an organisation.

Glad we got that settled then.

Reading some of these contributions, the phrase "bitter and twisted" kinda pops in there...

And they are incapable of owning-up to their inadequacies.

[VectraMan]

Originally Posted by PM-Junkie

Reading some of these contributions, the phrase "bitter and twisted" kinda pops in there...

Why should we be bitter and twisted? Just because PMs earn more than me, whilst not contributing anything and doing little work of any kind?

Oh wait, you may have a point.

I did once work with a very good PM, but that was where there was several seperate parts of a project that had to be brought together, but I think the difference is he was an engineer (and a very good one) who understood everything and really drove the whole project, and nobody was in any doubt that he worked as hard as anyone.

OTOH, I was once working on a project as sole developer, and I was given a PM who was entirely useless, wasn't capable of understanding the project and would just sit in the corner of meetings and quietly ask at the end for a summary of how long I thought it would take so he could go and update his chart. I felt a bit sorry for him really.

I get the impression PMs are a bit like salesman, in as much as salesman say they can sell anything, they don't need to know what it is or what it does. A good PM is one that really understands the project; a bad PM is one that waves their PRINCE (or whatever it is) certificate and thinks that makes them qualified to manage anything.

Or am I wrong?

[oracleslave]

Originally Posted by VectraMan

whilst not contributing anything and doing little work of any kind?

Oh Dear

Originally Posted by VectraMan

Or am I wrong?

Extremely.

[Cowboy Bob]

Originally Posted by VectraMan

Why should we be bitter and twisted? Just because PMs earn more than me, whilst not contributing anything and doing little work of any kind?

Oh wait, you may have a point.

I did once work with a very good PM, but that was where there was several seperate parts of a project that had to be brought together, but I think the difference is he was an engineer (and a very good one) who understood everything and really drove the whole project, and nobody was in any doubt that he worked as hard as anyone.

OTOH, I was once working on a project as sole developer, and I was given a PM who was entirely useless, wasn't capable of understanding the project and would just sit in the corner of meetings and quietly ask at the end for a summary of how long I thought it would take so he could go and update his chart. I felt a bit sorry for him really.

I get the impression PMs are a bit like salesman, in as much as salesman say they can sell anything, they don't need to know what it is or what it does. A good PM is one that really understands the project; a bad PM is one that waves their PRINCE (or whatever it is) certificate and thinks that makes them qualified to manage anything.

Or am I wrong?

[Cowboy Bob]

Originally Posted by oracleslave

Extremely.

No-one expects a PM to be able to help out with coding or anything like that, but if a PM can't adequately describe and understand the target platform of a project then they are useless as a PM as they cannot adequately serve as an effective buffer between IT and the business - which is ultimately their job.

A PM needs to have at least some technical understanding of the project, or regardless of their Prince 2 certificate, they are just a waste of space.