FYI: Manchester Client insisting on IR35 caught contract terms
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    Default FYI: Manchester Client insisting on IR35 caught contract terms

    I had an offer from a private sector client with a strong ethical reputation in Manchester.

    Everything looked great until I saw the paperwork.

    As well as a good main Agency contract from a Hopefully Normal agency, there was an extra doc to sign called <ClientName>_Amendments_<date_in_2012>.doc.

    This had provisions saying 'Clause x.y of main contract shall not apply' - that was the substitution clause - and something like 'contractors shall be subject to the supervision and control of the hiring manager'.

    Queried immediately and this was definitely a *client* stipulation, admittedly not from my hiring manager but from the top of the organisation. No amount of pressure from me or the hiring manager, who was extraordinarily keen and was reasonably high up their food chain, could get it changed.

    According to the agent, despite them having dozens of contractors on site and having placed a lot more there down the years - I was the first person to have ever queried it, and they were all working those terms.

    Fortunately I had another offer and although I wanted this one... I walked. (Yes I know there is a *chance* the engagement could still have been outside IR35 but on balance it was way outside the risk profile MyCo's Directors choose to operate under).

    Moral of the story: read every bit of detail in your contracts and cross-reference clause numbers and exceptions!

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    If it's an easy commute, you could have just asked for an extra 50 a day due to your LtdCo's rate card for working under IR35 caught contracts.
    The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he didn't exist

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    Good point, but in fact they'd already raised a similar amount to match my other offer, which was closer to home. And in my calculations, taking advantage of some legal options open to MyCo on engagements outside IR35, the impact would be a lot more than 50 anyway.

    I did want this one for lots of reasons, but it just wasn't going to happen. But at least I have a backup, which is cast-iron Outside and a fifteen minute commute.

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    Quote Originally Posted by matzie View Post
    Good point, but in fact they'd already raised a similar amount to match my other offer, which was closer to home. And in my calculations, taking advantage of some legal options open to MyCo on engagements outside IR35, the impact would be a lot more than 50 anyway.

    I did want this one for lots of reasons, but it just wasn't going to happen. But at least I have a backup, which is cast-iron Outside and a fifteen minute commute.
    I'm just waiting to see what happens when people do raise their rate to cover inside IR35 and agents start catching on. At that point, it may be telling but until then while the BoS guys are blissfully unaware, it'll continue as it is I would suspect.
    The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world that he didn't exist

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    Quote Originally Posted by LondonManc View Post
    I'm just waiting to see what happens when people do raise their rate to cover inside IR35 and agents start catching on. At that point, it may be telling but until then while the BoS guys are blissfully unaware, it'll continue as it is I would suspect.
    Even afterwards there will be enough BoS people for it not to make much impact...
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    Quote Originally Posted by eek View Post
    Even afterwards there will be enough BoS people for it not to make much impact...
    Quite probably. They'll just be wondering what happened to their bottom line for a few months, grumble a bit then carry on.
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    Quote Originally Posted by matzie View Post
    I had an offer from a private sector client with a strong ethical reputation in Manchester.

    Everything looked great until I saw the paperwork.

    As well as a good main Agency contract from a Hopefully Normal agency, there was an extra doc to sign called <ClientName>_Amendments_<date_in_2012>.doc.

    This had provisions saying 'Clause x.y of main contract shall not apply' - that was the substitution clause - and something like 'contractors shall be subject to the supervision and control of the hiring manager'.

    Queried immediately and this was definitely a *client* stipulation, admittedly not from my hiring manager but from the top of the organisation. No amount of pressure from me or the hiring manager, who was extraordinarily keen and was reasonably high up their food chain, could get it changed.

    According to the agent, despite them having dozens of contractors on site and having placed a lot more there down the years - I was the first person to have ever queried it, and they were all working those terms.

    Fortunately I had another offer and although I wanted this one... I walked. (Yes I know there is a *chance* the engagement could still have been outside IR35 but on balance it was way outside the risk profile MyCo's Directors choose to operate under).

    Moral of the story: read every bit of detail in your contracts and cross-reference clause numbers and exceptions!
    Ha ha. Yeah right.
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    Is it Co-op, near Victoria then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by stek View Post
    Is it Co-op, near Victoria then?
    I was going to say that I'm banking on it them being unco-operative.... but I think I needed an insurance policy...

    I'm sorry....
    merely at clientco for the entertainment

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    Quote Originally Posted by eek View Post
    I was going to say that I'm banking on it them being unco-operative.... but I think I needed an insurance policy...

    I'm sorry....
    I was there in 2012, laptop they issued me with wasn't even widescreen.....

    IBM have a lot of bods on site there presently, I just turned them down in fact, that place is like going bck to the 1960's....

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