I got Back Stabbed by an Agent(!)... your help welcome

[The Lone Gunman]

Originally Posted by shanti

Okay :-). Am skimming through 50 pages of the act - right now.

Not exactly bedtime reading, but will take a look. I guess its something to waive to the agency in order to get them back to the table.

More importantly its ammo when going to the client...

"Hey Mr Client PLC, look at these agency cowboys that your Mr Manager asked me to go through - they are not on your PSL - and I have been messed around by them".

Thus, will ensure the agency will never get onto the PSL of big, prestigious Client PLC.

Capiche?

It has been a long week. If you are going to survive you need to know the rules. We can discuss detail, but you have to know what you are talking about.
How are you on IR35?

[BrilloPad]

Originally Posted by The Lone Gunman

It has been a long week. If you are going to survive you need to know the rules. We can discuss detail, but you have to know what you are talking about.
How are you on IR35?

What is that noise I hear? Oh yeah - its Mal spinning in his grave!

[Ardesco]

Originally Posted by shanti

Hello.. have you seen the market out there?

I heard some agent got 600 CVs for one position. Some of them being Travel and Finance people - trying to get out of their industries.

I am unsure of the market. But intend to do both, try and fight this as well as keep eyes open.

so you think the Market is bad but you are going out of your way to alienate an agency and bring the end client into your squabble and you think this is more likely to get you a gig...... If I was the end client I would kikc you into touch as soon as you strted trying to involve me you don't hire contractor to potentialy get more legal headaches permies are a cheaper way of having those....

I would say get a grip and look for a new gig. An agent is not legally bound to give you terms and conditions that you like. Sign the. Contract or look for a new one and stop moaning!

[shanti]

Originally Posted by Ardesco

so you think the Market is bad but you are going out of your way to alienate an agency and bring the end client into your squabble and you think this is more likely to get you a gig...... If I was the end client I would kikc you into touch as soon as you strted trying to involve me you don't hire contractor to potentialy get more legal headaches permies are a cheaper way of having those....

I would say get a grip and look for a new gig. An agent is not legally bound to give you terms and conditions that you like. Sign the. Contract or look for a new one and stop moaning!

If you don't start holding the agents accountable to their clients - contractors are going to whacked left, right and centre. We are businesses contracting in (not the scum of the earth) - fair and reasonable behaviour from agents are not asking too much. I am certainly not allowing an agency to misrepresent my position for their commercial gain - or minimum - going to complain about it when it happens(!)

[Another Dodgy Agent]

Originally Posted by shanti

If you don't start holding the agents accountable to their clients - contractors are going to whacked left, right and centre. We are businesses contracting in (not the scum of the earth) - fair and reasonable behaviour from agents are not asking too much. I am certainly not allowing an agency to misrepresent my position for their commercial gain - or minimum - going to complain about it when it happens(!)

That's the point isn't it Shanti. Your issue is not losing the role, or the client its the agent. Pretty much every reply you have given on this thread is about your resentment to the agency.

Now in my humble experience if an end client wants a candidate they will take them on regardless of agency/HR/nuclear conflict etc. Especially given this agency is currently not on the PSL of the client then the client would use a PSL agency to provide you with a contract and payroll your invoices/timesheets.

I regularly get asked to payroll contractors because of difficulties with another agency, so if I were you I would suggest you start looking to the client and stop moaning about the agent.

[shanti]

Originally Posted by Another Dodgy Agent

That's the point isn't it Shanti. Your issue is not losing the role, or the client its the agent. Pretty much every reply you have given on this thread is about your resentment to the agency.

Now in my humble experience if an end client wants a candidate they will take them on regardless of agency/HR/nuclear conflict etc. Especially given this agency is currently not on the PSL of the client then the client would use a PSL agency to provide you with a contract and payroll your invoices/timesheets.

I regularly get asked to payroll contractors because of difficulties with another agency, so if I were you I would suggest you start looking to the client and stop moaning about the agent.

Good advice. Am am escalating to the client as I type. But quite a lot of agents - lock out the client from working with the contractor - once they have introduced them.

[Another Dodgy Agent]

Originally Posted by shanti

Good advice. Am am escalating to the client as I type. But quite a lot of agents - lock out the client from working with the contractor - once they have introduced them.

In your case you have not signed (I assume) the agency contract for this gig so they cannot enforce that particular clause (and in any event it is virtually impossible to enforce). Even if they did hold you to the "6 months, talk to the client and you die a horrible, horrible death" clause, worst case is the agency will be trying to sue you for loss of commission, the maximum loss being the notice period i.e. 4 weeks which in most cases is not worth chasing for as the potential legal costs will far outweigh any amount of lost commission, unless your on £100000 per day of course.

[shanti]

Originally Posted by Another Dodgy Agent

In your case you have not signed (I assume) the agency contract for this gig so they cannot enforce that particular clause (and in any event it is virtually impossible to enforce). Even if they did hold you to the "6 months, talk to the client and you die a horrible, horrible death" clause, worst case is the agency will be trying to sue you for loss of commission, the maximum loss being the notice period i.e. 4 weeks which in most cases is not worth chasing for as the potential legal costs will far outweigh any amount of lost commission, unless your on £100000 per day of course.

Thanks. But I would have thought the master schedule (or Client contract) is possibly already signed between the agency and the Client.

It 'may' say that the Client cannot take any of the contractors introduced, through another agency. They tend to pitch you as their candidate, by sticking their company name on top of your CV and sending you in.

Just speculating, as I would have thought something like this is contained in most agency contracts with their clients.

[shanti]

Originally Posted by Another Dodgy Agent

Now in my humble experience if an end client wants a candidate they will take them on regardless of agency/HR/nuclear conflict etc. Especially given this agency is currently not on the PSL of the client then the client would use a PSL agency to provide you with a contract and payroll your invoices/timesheets.

True. They would. But if you have been rubbished and smacked talked by the agent behind your back, - the client may just believe what the agent is saying. Specially if the agent is saying "don't waste your time with this one.. got another three here, who are good to go, take your pick".

[Ardesco]

Originally Posted by shanti

True. They would. But if you have been rubbished and smacked talked by the agent behind your back, - the client may just believe what the agent is saying. Specially if the agent is saying "don't waste your time with this one.. got another three here, who are good to go, take your pick".

Do you have any proof that you have been "rubbished" and "smack talked"?? It is likely that they said to the end client that you wanted unreasonable T&C's in the contract (Which in their opinion you probably did).

If I was the end client I wouldn't be interested in an overly militant contractor who is liable to cause problems, I just want somebody who will come in and get the job done quickly. By kicking up a stink the end client may have formed an opinion of you on thier own without any input from the agency, I doubt the agency will bother trying to correct them if this has happened.

As for references, you are by your own admission opted in so they legally have to take references and check your previous work history/qualifications. Trying to bust their balls over the conduct of employment agents act is not going to achieve anything but validate their insistence on you providing references and they will now almost certainly only offer you an IR35 caught contract.

If you really want to take it further get a legal letter written to the agency demanding to see all communication between you and the end client under the freedom of information act, and highlight the fact that it is a criminal offence to delete this information rather than hand it over. Also send the same letter to the end client and make sure the information tallies. You can then waste lots of time and money trying to take them to court where they will delay as long as they can and it will cost you a fortune in lost earnings. You will also have a tough time proving libel (which is all you are going to be able to try and do from what you have written so far), if you have in fact been libelled.

The best thing to do in a situation like this would have been send a polite and quiet letter to the end client explaining why you were unable to take the contract, but now that you have kicked of and tried to "escalate it to them" they really aren't going to be interested. I doubt you will get an offer of a direct placement or the ability to go through another agency because they have undoubtedly signed some clause with the agent you are currently stuck with that will enable the agency to threaten legal action. Once that happens you are out of there, no end client is going to want the hassle of fighting off a potential law suit if they hire you.

Sorry buddy but I think you have shot yourself in the foot.